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Thread: If Russia caused Trump to win does that mean Americans are easily led?

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    Veteran Member Will Wiley's Avatar
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    If Russia caused Trump to win does that mean Americans are easily led?

    If Russia caused Trump to win and Clinton to lose does that mean Americans are easily led?

    How is it that Russia somehow controlled the result of the recent Presidential election, through hacking or lies or something equally bad.
    How were Americans fooled by that...are they just not able to distinguish truth from fiction?

    The Americans I know are independent thinkers , smart, and not easily duped, so I find it hard to understand how Russia was supposed to have some strange control over the country.
    Last edited by Will Wiley; 05-28-2017 at 05:05 AM.

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    Fair dinkum thinkum bilby's Avatar
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    Americans are easily led.

    Humans are easily led.

    Thinking is hard; most people don't bother with it, instead choosing to trust someone else to do their thinking for them.

    Just look at the shit people buy - "Free from BPA and Parabens", screams the label. Ask a thousand people who picked that one over the cheaper one next to it on the shelf, and nine hundred and ninety nine won't be able to tell you what 'BPA' stands for or what it does; or what a Paraben is, whether it's bad, or why they avoid it.

    But they will try to avoid these things, because they trust the label. The label wouldn't claim the product was free of things that were harmless, would it? Even though by doing so, it makes someone richer than they otherwise would have been. And obviously nobody misleads people in order to make money. Obviously.

    Humans are very easily duped. Americans are no exception in this regard.

    ETA: It doesn't matter whether or not BPA or Parabens actually are harmful; the fact remains that people believe that they are based on utterly inadequate and untrustworthy evidence, and not because of any actual thought on their part.

    Humans trust slogans, memes, tall people, handsome people, and men with deep voices; but are deeply distrustful of science.

    Humans are basically fucking idiots. A tiny handful are aware that they are idiots. None (present company included) think hard about everything they do, when trusting someone for bad reasons is an option.

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    Veteran Member Will Wiley's Avatar
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    Actually looking here...http://www.foxnews.com/politics/inte...y-24-2017.html
    Only 30% of people polled think Russia influenced the election a lot and 14% a little.

    But they might be Fox people. I think it's closer to 90% of people around here :P

    But, my god!..how can we stop Russia controlling who ends up President of the USA. It seems people are powerless in the face of this mighty Russian threat!

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    Contributor blastula's Avatar
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    Who here has said Russia is the cause?
    Last edited by blastula; 05-28-2017 at 08:24 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Will Wiley View Post
    If Russia caused Trump to win and Clinton to lose does that mean Americans are easily led?

    How is it that Russia somehow controlled the result of the recent Presidential election, through hacking or lies or something equally bad.
    How were Americans fooled by that...are they just not able to distinguish truth from fiction?

    The Americans I know are independent thinkers , smart, and not easily duped, so I find it hard to understand how Russia was supposed to have some strange control over the country.
    Many Americans in this respect are mistaking assumptions and accusations as facts.

    So far there is no concrete evidence to conclusively demonstrate or on weight of evidence that Russia magically influenced the election or that Hillary ran a Brothel from a Pizza house.

    Judging by the fact that any route the enquiries are taking are fed to the press, tends to be indicative of a weak case.

    If anything it seems that the US media tried to influence the election, mostly supporting Clinton.

    The US had an election in which Trump was not supposed to have won. Hillary blamed the FBI regarding an investigation into her emails, but Trump was also receiving negative publicity in the press.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by blastula View Post
    Who here has said hi Russia is the cause?
    One just has to accuse; that's the way propaganda works.

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    Veteran Member Deepak's Avatar
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    This is a comically defective induction even by historical standards. And then the appeal to a public opinion poll as if that's somehow relevant.

    Is there another tainted batch of bath lotion going around?

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    Intergalactic Villainess Angry Floof's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whichphilosophy View Post

    One just has to accuse; that's the way propaganda works.
    You should know. Your cult specifically trains followers in these tactics. Most people probably don't know that it's church policy to use them against whoever the authority says is an SP. Insinuation is only the beginning of official church harassment techniques.
    The Authoritarians

    GOP and Trump supporters will not be able to say they didn't know. Vote in numbers too big to manipulate.

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    Veteran Member Ford's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whichphilosophy View Post
    So far there is no concrete evidence to conclusively demonstrate or on weight of evidence that Russia magically influenced the election or that Hillary ran a Brothel from a Pizza house.
    Well they didn't "magically" influence the election, but the evidence is clear that they tried like hell to do so, and that the result was the one they were looking for.

    I know that you and Will and Barbos and Tupac all think that Russia is our bestest buddy and would never do anything underhanded to try an undermine the US, but that's a pretty naive position to take. Russian espionage goes back as far as when we were actually allies in WWII if not further. Putin has been playing the long con since before he rode around with W in a pickup truck. The work that used to be done by Pravda is now being handled by bots and paid trolls, while the spy business has expanded to include hackers and useful idiots like Assange. And of course people who go out of their way to defend Putin free of charge on message boards and comment sections.

    Sorry, but no amount of L Ron inspired bullshit is going to convince me that Vlad is just a misunderstood teddy bear.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angry Floof View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by whichphilosophy View Post

    One just has to accuse; that's the way propaganda works.
    You should know. Your cult specifically trains followers in these tactics. Most people probably don't know that it's church policy to use them against whoever the authority says is an SP. Insinuation is only the beginning of official church harassment techniques.
    I don't look at religion; I look at our history in law which the US and UK share. This relates to what I said. The legal way of proof, though different in structure of research is still evidence based. The Media hasn't demonstrated adherence to evidence based practices but of marketing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ford View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by whichphilosophy View Post
    So far there is no concrete evidence to conclusively demonstrate or on weight of evidence that Russia magically influenced the election or that Hillary ran a Brothel from a Pizza house.
    Well they didn't "magically" influence the election, but the evidence is clear that they tried like hell to do so, and that the result was the one they were looking for.

    I know that you and Will and Barbos and Tupac all think that Russia is our bestest buddy and would never do anything underhanded to try an undermine the US, but that's a pretty naive position to take. Russian espionage goes back as far as when we were actually allies in WWII if not further. Putin has been playing the long con since before he rode around with W in a pickup truck. The work that used to be done by Pravda is now being handled by bots and paid trolls, while the spy business has expanded to include hackers and useful idiots like Assange. And of course people who go out of their way to defend Putin free of charge on message boards and comment sections.

    Sorry, but no amount of L Ron inspired bullshit is going to convince me that Vlad is just a misunderstood teddy bear.
    B-a-a-a-h
    Vlad is misunderstood. He doesn't get help from Hubbard since he is deceased.
    The Americans, Russians and British all try to hack each other. It's an extension of spying. Look at all this ransom-ware. It was stolen from the NSA/

    All the bleating doesn't detract from the fact that there is no concrete evidence to prove anything about Trump, Clinton anyone else.

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