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Thread: The Bible is holy and from god. Oh, and also you have to understand the times in which it was written. WUT?

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    Cyborg with a Tiara
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    The Bible is holy and from god. Oh, and also you have to understand the times in which it was written. WUT?

    These two things are incompatible and also frequently used by christians who don’t see the contradiction.

    Talking today with a Christian trying to justify the cruelty of having to marry your rapist - so that he can rape you for the rest of your life. But! But! You have to understand the times, she was now an outcast and he had to take care of her to keep her alive!

    Dude. So maybe the bible should say, “if you rape, you have to pay for her needs for the rest of her life, and you have to stay away from her, oh and also, all you other people, don’t be dicks to her, it’s not her fault.”

    But apparently the god of the times couldn’t manage that kind of foresight.

    Also it admits that the god of the times had no control over the mores of the times. Sad!

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    Sapere aude Politesse's Avatar
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    Indeed. It bugs me when they plumb modern Biblical scholarship for support when they think said scholars are in agreement with them, but then utterly ignore, even contemn, the conclusions those same scholars come to on questions like authorship, authenticity, language, or political bias. Fundamentalist hermeneutics rely surprisingly heavily on lies, considering the advice of the Bible itself on the importance of honesty.

    "Εἴ τις δοκεῖ θρησκὸς εἶναι μὴ χαλιναγωγῶν γλῶσσαν αὐτοῦ ἀλλὰ ἀπατῶν καρδίαν αὐτοῦ, τούτου μάταιος ἡ θρησκεία."/
    "Those who consider themselves pious and but do not keep a tight rein on their tongue deceive their own hearts, and their 'piety' is worthless." ~James 1:26

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    Veteran Member Cheerful Charlie's Avatar
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    So God wrote a Bible that was not truly moral because, ermmm, what was that again? No,it doesn't make sense. A real God would explain a truly moral way of life for benefit of the savages, not cave in to reinforcing the savages' poor moral understandings. God then is not a leader, but something less than moral.

    This is a rationalization that collapses under its own lack of credibility and lack of logic. Then we have to ask the question what parts of today's Christian "absolute" and Bible based morality is likewise lacking in true morality because God is creating that Bible morality to our failed ability to understand true morality?
    Cheerful Charlie

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    Contributor DrZoidberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhea View Post
    These two things are incompatible and also frequently used by christians who don’t see the contradiction.

    Talking today with a Christian trying to justify the cruelty of having to marry your rapist - so that he can rape you for the rest of your life. But! But! You have to understand the times, she was now an outcast and he had to take care of her to keep her alive!

    Dude. So maybe the bible should say, “if you rape, you have to pay for her needs for the rest of her life, and you have to stay away from her, oh and also, all you other people, don’t be dicks to her, it’s not her fault.”

    But apparently the god of the times couldn’t manage that kind of foresight.

    Also it admits that the god of the times had no control over the mores of the times. Sad!
    There's a third option. An all powerful entity could continually update all Bibles to fit the times. The fact that the Bible stays the same and doesn't magically keep changing I think is evidence against the existience of God.

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    Senior Member excreationist's Avatar
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    "...you have to understand the times in which it was written..."

    Yes.

    Matthew 19:7-9
    .... “Why then,” they asked, “did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away?”

    Jesus replied, “Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.”...

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    Senior Member OLDMAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by excreationist View Post
    "...you have to understand the times in which it was written..."

    Yes.

    Matthew 19:7-9
    .... “Why then,” they asked, “did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away?”

    Jesus replied, “Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.”...
    So what. later he says you can't look at a women without committing adultery....hard on the teenagers.

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    Contributor DrZoidberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OLDMAN View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by excreationist View Post
    "...you have to understand the times in which it was written..."

    Yes.

    Matthew 19:7-9
    .... “Why then,” they asked, “did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away?”

    Jesus replied, “Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.”...
    So what. later he says you can't look at a women without committing adultery....hard on the teenagers.
    That never really went away with me. I covet like crazy all day

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    Senior Member excreationist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OLDMAN View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by excreationist View Post
    "...you have to understand the times in which it was written..."

    Yes.

    Matthew 19:7-9
    .... “Why then,” they asked, “did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away?”

    Jesus replied, “Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.”...
    So what. later he says you can't look at a women without committing adultery....hard on the teenagers.
    That was written at a time when everyone is said to have broken the law, including times when they deserved death (due to "adultery"). Though Jesus says lust is punished by hell (talking about plucking out your eye).

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    From the 60s onward, Christian writers have railed against situation ethics. What is "God allowed you to do this because your hearts were hard" but situation ethics? I've heard the same horseshit explanation for the Bible on slavery, i.e., that was the way it was, back then, but God's law tried to make it a better world for the slave, and the NT provided for the eventual downfall of slavery. A total crock. The anti-abolitionist clergy of the pre-Civil War days had it absolutely right: the Bible sees it as completely moral to buy and sell people and beat them to the point of death if ya want. God lets ya. Go ahead and don't think twice.
    Last edited by ideologyhunter; 09-04-2018 at 03:14 PM.

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    Sapere aude Politesse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ideologyhunter View Post
    From the 60s onward, Christian writers have railed against situation ethics. What is "God allowed you to do this because your hearts were hard" but situation ethics? I've heard the same horseshit explanation for the Bible on slavery, i.e., that was the way it was, back then, but God's law tried to make it a better world for the slave, and the NT provided for the eventual downfall of slavery. A total crock. The anti-abolitionist clergy of the pre-Civil War days had it absolutely right: the Bible sees it as completely moral to buy and sell people and beat them to the point of death if ya want. God lets ya. Go ahead and don't think twice.
    Why, in your opinion, was it believed for centuries that slavery was against the law of God? Indeed, even during the years of the African slave trade itself; buying and selling of human beings was still illegal in Europe, and for religious reasons. They had merely devised a workaround having to due with the then-recently invented concept of race and some tortured interpretations of some passages in Genesis. You couldn't enslave, say, a white Belgian. Or a Swede. Because that would be un-Christian. You could enslave an Irishman, but only if you pretended they were an indentured servant rather than a slave as such.

    Deeply hypocritical, yes, but a bit odd considering your claim that the Biblical case for the pro-slavery position is airtight. If that is so, why didn't the pro-slavery crowd just say so, and resume open enslavement regardless of race? Are you claiming, like your forebears, that the Bible only clearly advocates the enslavement of people with black skin?

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