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Thread: Democrats 2020

  1. Top | #3591
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    This article sums up why I can't stand Elizabeth Warren. She has been drinking way to deeply from fashionable nonsense coming out contemporary academia, fully embracing stuff like "intersectionality", or as I call it, "wokeness".

    Elizabeth Warren Is Running an Unapologetically Intersectional Campaign

    Unfortunately, The Nation is fully embracing capitalist paywalls so the full article is not readable without giving them these socialists some filthy lucre, but luckily DailyKos has some excerpts here.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Nation via DailyKos
    § In her plan on “Valuing the Work of Women of Color” (yes, she actually has a plan for that—a claim no other candidate can make), Warren acknowledges how the interplay of sexual and gender identities (as well as ability) with racial identities can exacerbate the obstacles women of color face.
    [...]
    When she calls black trans women the “backbone of democracy” and focuses on her own education in the politics of intersectionality and apologizes quickly over the treatment of black women in her Nevada campaign office she actually “does” intersectional politics.
    [...]
    Admission to a school won’t prevent a beating on the sidewalk outside.”
    And as we all know, only those who are intersections of a sufficient number of certain categories can become victims of senseless violence. Np cis- heterosexual while male was ever attacked on the street.


    And of course, DailyKos is outwokenessing Warren and Suzanna Walters (author of the Nation piece) who complain that it's not PC for a white (hey, isn't she Cherokee?) woman to be hailed as intersectional, as she is not an intersection of more than one preferred identity. I mean she is not even lesbian or trans, even if she puts gratuitous pronouns in her Twitter bio.

    Does anybody think Dems will win against Trump with "discourse" like this? It makes the Orange Menace sound like the smart one.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  2. Top | #3592
    Sapere aude Politesse's Avatar
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    Elizabeth Warren is a spokesperson for misunderstanding intersectionality theory.

  3. Top | #3593
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    Quote Originally Posted by Politesse View Post
    Elizabeth Warren is a spokesperson for misunderstanding intersectionality theory.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  4. Top | #3594
    Administrator lpetrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derec View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by lpetrich View Post
    BTW, the NYT now has results for 100% of the caucuses counted: Nevada Caucuses 2020: Live Election Results - The New York Times
    Your candidate math ignores (deliberately?) the fact that there is a 15% threshold and that only some delegates are based on statewide results, with others being allocated by congressional district.
    I wanted to do statewide proportional allocation.

    Using a statewide threshold of 15% gives (Bernie Sanders, Joe Biden) = (25, 11) delegates or (24,12) for groups of 3 delegates.


    Sanders Senior Advisor Chuck Rocha: How we got 73% of Latinos - YouTube - "Bernie Sanders' Senior Advisor Chuck Rocha reacts to his boss' Nevada victory and lays out the campaign's plans for South Carolina and Super Tuesday."

    By reaching out to them.

  5. Top | #3595
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    Assuming that Sanders is or becomes the Democratic nominee, did he lose Florida with his most recent comments about Castro?

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/24/u...o-florida.html


    Comments from Senator Bernie Sanders praising aspects of the Communist Cuban revolution drew a forceful rebuke on Monday from Cuban-Americans, Florida Democrats and several of Mr. Sanders’s opponents, who cast him as too extreme in his views to represent the party as its presidential nominee.

    Mr. Sanders’s remarks threatened to undercut his candidacy in the nation’s largest presidential battleground state as he seeks to build momentum on a broader scale after a series of early primary victories. In Florida, Mr. Sanders stands to alienate not just Cubans but also a far more diverse group of Latinos, including Colombians, Nicaraguans and Venezuelans, than the ones he won overwhelmingly in Saturday’s Nevada caucuses.

    “I’m totally disgusted and insulted,” said Lourdes Diaz, the president of the Democratic Hispanic Caucus in Broward County, who is Cuban-American. “Maybe this will open people’s eyes to how super, super liberal and radical Bernie is. I’m not going to defend him anymore. I’m over it.”
    I know that people often love Sanders because he is supposedly consistent, but there are times when you're running in a primary race for the presidency of the US, that you need to be more sensitive and careful that you don't say things that can be easily misunderstood by people who you need to attract to your candidacy.

    He has a long habit of praising dictatorial regimes, especially in the past. I know all of this baggage will be used against him by Trump and company, so what the fuck is he thinking by adding more baggage! When people ask me why I am very highly skeptical of a Sanders victory, this is just one example. I don't like it when people bring up what candidates have said or done decades ago, but candidates need to have some polish and not double down on their same mistakes.

    I guess anything is possible, but it looks right now like Bernie can kiss Florida goodbye.

    Here's what he could have said:

    We welcome immigrants from Cuba and we value their education. That would be a true statement, and it wouldn't be insulting to anyone who despises Castro but loves their heritage.

  6. Top | #3596
    Sapere aude Politesse's Avatar
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    It's just a standard issue media circus, only political junkies will remember it a week from now.

  7. Top | #3597
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    Quote Originally Posted by southernhybrid View Post
    Assuming that Sanders is or becomes the Democratic nominee, did he lose Florida with his most recent comments about Castro?

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/24/u...o-florida.html


    Comments from Senator Bernie Sanders praising aspects of the Communist Cuban revolution drew a forceful rebuke on Monday from Cuban-Americans, Florida Democrats and several of Mr. Sanders’s opponents, who cast him as too extreme in his views to represent the party as its presidential nominee.

    Mr. Sanders’s remarks threatened to undercut his candidacy in the nation’s largest presidential battleground state as he seeks to build momentum on a broader scale after a series of early primary victories. In Florida, Mr. Sanders stands to alienate not just Cubans but also a far more diverse group of Latinos, including Colombians, Nicaraguans and Venezuelans, than the ones he won overwhelmingly in Saturday’s Nevada caucuses.

    “I’m totally disgusted and insulted,” said Lourdes Diaz, the president of the Democratic Hispanic Caucus in Broward County, who is Cuban-American. “Maybe this will open people’s eyes to how super, super liberal and radical Bernie is. I’m not going to defend him anymore. I’m over it.”
    I know that people often love Sanders because he is supposedly consistent, but there are times when you're running in a primary race for the presidency of the US, that you need to be more sensitive and careful that you don't say things that can be easily misunderstood by people who you need to attract to your candidacy.

    He has a long habit of praising dictatorial regimes, especially in the past. I know all of this baggage will be used against him by Trump and company, so what the fuck is he thinking by adding more baggage! When people ask me why I am very highly skeptical of a Sanders victory, this is just one example. I don't like it when people bring up what candidates have said or done decades ago, but candidates need to have some polish and not double down on their same mistakes.

    I guess anything is possible, but it looks right now like Bernie can kiss Florida goodbye.

    Here's what he could have said:

    We welcome immigrants from Cuba and we value their education. That would be a true statement, and it wouldn't be insulting to anyone who despises Castro but loves their heritage.
    On the flip side, a large segment of the population sees through not answering questions directly. You are talking about triangulating instead as if people when they see pivoting don't recognize it. We're not some super class of highly intelligent who are better than everyone else who can be easily tricked by words, non-answers, and wordsmithing. While many, many people are stupid, they still have instincts and can read when an answer is evasive or trying to appeal to someone.

    This is something Third Way Democratic politicians need to understand more.

    Now, I can't read the whole the article and can only see the initial few sentences and headline. It seems like he said that it would be unfair to say everything was bad about Cuba. I agree 100%. It's also unfair to say everything is bad with the Trump regime or just about any regime. Health care in Cuba has been pretty good and many of Cuba's problems have to do with externalities such as the economic and other sanctions, not things internal to Cuba. That said, they are also some bad things about Cuba, but we can't pretend there are not a few decent policies, just because Fidel was a dictator who took down a fascist and then never let go of control.

    Now I found a different link that doesn't have a wall where I can look at a bigger quote rather than a quote-mine in the first sentences.

    Here is what Bernie said:
    "We're very opposed to the authoritarian nature of Cuba but you know, it's unfair to simply say everything is bad. You know? When Fidel Castro came into office, you know what he did? He had a massive literacy program. Is that a bad thing? Even though Fidel Castro did it?"

    1. Are you very opposed to the authoritarian nature of Cuba?
    2. Did the Castro regime improve the literacy of Cuba?
    3. Doesn't Bernie admit that he is very opposed to the authoritarian nature of Cuba?

  8. Top | #3598
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    Sorry, but I disagree. IF this comment was so insignificant, why are so many Democrats in Florida having a fit about it? To me, this is one of Sanders problems. He speaks like a raving maniac, without carefully thinking through what he says. Now, that might not bother the two of you, but I assure you it's going to have an impact on a lot of other voters. Will he still be able to win in November. I remain highly skeptical. I know exactly what he said, but people who were victims of Castro, don't want to be told anything good about his regime. Sanders has no tact whatsoever.

    And as far as only political junkies remembering this, I don't think you're considering the tons of adds, which will snip out the worst part of his comment. I predict that will played again and again, especially in Florida and other states that have a lot of Hispanic immigrants that came from oppressive countries. This is going to probably be the nastiest race we've ever seen. And Sanders better learn to think before he speaks, if he's even capable of that. I have my doubts.

    I used to think he was the kooky leftie in Congress. I even liked the guy when I was younger. Now, I see him way in over his head, ego driven without a realistic plan. The only things that might save him is for the economy to tank, or for people to finally get so disgusted with Trump that they will vote for any alternative.

  9. Top | #3599
    Industrial Grade Linguist Copernicus's Avatar
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    I don't think that Sanders will lose Florida over this one casual comment. What he said is true. Not everything that Communists have done has been bad. Cubans are highly educated and have made some considerable advances in medical care. However, it was a comment that could, and will, be taken out of context and used against him. He really needs to avoid putting himself in the role of a salesman for socialism. He should do more to explain what has been wrong with these regimes, and I think he is starting to realize that. He should do more to tie Trump to the dictators that Trump has cozied up to.

  10. Top | #3600
    Contributor PyramidHead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Copernicus View Post
    I don't think that Sanders will lose Florida over this one casual comment. What he said is true. Not everything that Communists have done has been bad. Cubans are highly educated and have made some considerable advances in medical care. However, it was a comment that could, and will, be taken out of context and used against him. He really needs to avoid putting himself in the role of a salesman for socialism. He should do more to explain what has been wrong with these regimes, and I think he is starting to realize that. He should do more to tie Trump to the dictators that Trump has cozied up to.
    He is in a tough spot, because many of his supporters are aware of the truth about Castro(which is that he was a hero to Cuba and one of the greatest people who ever lived), but he is running for the president of a settler-colonial empire that is committed to snuffing out socialist countries and painting their leaders as despots. The American left doesn't want to confront that yet and just wants comfortable socialism within its own borders. If Bernie fails to enact his reforms due to the institutional barriers that will be placed in his way, my hope is that the left will become radicalized by this and rethink their indoctrination about Cuba, the USSR, and other places where socialism is being built. But now isn't the time for that conversation, as most of the comments on this forum demonstrate.

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