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Thread: Do we have to chose between atheism and theism?

  1. Top | #21
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    Believing in a god / Not believing a god constitutes a true dichotomy.
    Either you do or you don't.
    If you're 15 minutes old, you're not a believer. Atheist
    If you didn't believe and now you do: Theist

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    Veteran Member Sarpedon's Avatar
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    What word do you use to describe someone who believes that while there is some uncertainty, there's sufficient evidence to draw a reasonable conclusion?

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    Veteran Member George S's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarpedon View Post
    What word do you use to describe someone who believes that while there is some uncertainty, there's sufficient evidence to draw a reasonable conclusion?
    Bayesian.

    It is all about probabilities and consequences. Belief is not accomplished by an act of will; belief is forced by experience and reason. The axiom of experience applies: The future will be like the past because, in the past, the future has been like past. The skies repeat with regularity. Seasons or a midnight sun: predictable. They come as regular as clockwork. In the past religions have come and gone. Gods were around in abundance. Different tribes had different gods. Some lived on a mountain top or volcano. Some down in the sea. Some in charge of weather and fertility, others in charge of love and war. They are, by and large, now considered mythology. In the future, I expect current religions to be called myths in time.

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    Veteran Member skepticalbip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by George S View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sarpedon View Post
    What word do you use to describe someone who believes that while there is some uncertainty, there's sufficient evidence to draw a reasonable conclusion?
    Bayesian.

    It is all about probabilities and consequences. Belief is not accomplished by an act of will; belief is forced by experience and reason. The axiom of experience applies: The future will be like the past because, in the past, the future has been like past. The skies repeat with regularity. Seasons or a midnight sun: predictable. They come as regular as clockwork. In the past religions have come and gone. Gods were around in abundance. Different tribes had different gods. Some lived on a mountain top or volcano. Some down in the sea. Some in charge of weather and fertility, others in charge of love and war. They are, by and large, now considered mythology. In the future, I expect current religions to be called myths in time.
    I think you are mixing "believing" and "understanding". Belief is driven more by the emotionions while understanding is driven more by rational analysis.

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    Elder Contributor Keith&Co.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skepticalbip View Post
    I think you are mixing "believing" and "understanding". Belief is driven more by the emotionions while understanding is driven more by rational analysis.
    Yeah, that feels right.

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    Veteran Member skepticalbip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith&Co. View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by skepticalbip View Post
    I think you are mixing "believing" and "understanding". Belief is driven more by the emotionions while understanding is driven more by rational analysis.
    Yeah, that feels right.
    Oh damn... I've been Kevened....

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    Veteran Member Wiploc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarpedon View Post
    What word do you use to describe someone who believes that while there is some uncertainty, there's sufficient evidence to draw a reasonable conclusion?
    Human? Patsy? Theist? Atheist?

    Not sure what you're after. I meet your requirements, and I call myself an agnostic strong atheist. My mother would probably say she met your requirements, and she was an agnostic Christian.

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    Veteran Member Sarpedon's Avatar
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    What I'm getting at is that it isn't necessarily a dichotomy. This whole proof or certainty vs unprovable or uncertain thing is bullshit. Nothing is certain, but in the absence of certainty, reasonable conclusions are still possible. Don't let the words blind you into thinking that what they describe are the only possibilities.

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    As I've posted elsewhere and will post again and again until I am blue in the face (fingers?), I think that any honest consideration of the universe, on the basis of the actual recorded and verifiable evidence, indicates that IF there is a God, that God prefers evidence-based action in the universe because evidence based approaches work more effectively than other approaches.

    With that in mind, I think that the choice isn't between "theism" and "atheism", but that informed theism is acting as an atheist and that God prefers atheists if such a God exists; they made a universe where being an atheist yeilds better results.

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