View Poll Results: Do humans have an inherent capacity to decide that a conclusion follows necessarily from premises?

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  • Yes

    7 77.78%
  • No

    1 11.11%
  • I don't know

    1 11.11%
  • The question doesn't make sense

    0 0%
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Thread: Do humans have an inherent capacity to decide that a conclusion follows necessarily from premises?

  1. Top | #11
    Contributor Speakpigeon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    Ancient humans started with fire yada yada yada....
    What's understandable in your soliloquy is massively irrelevant.

    Once again, you prefer to indulge in a silly rant than to address the topic at hand.

    Let me remind you of the question: Do humans have an inherent capacity to decide that a conclusion follows necessarily from premises?

    I think that question is really simple... But not for you apparently. It's clearly way beyond the capacity of your brain.
    EB

  2. Top | #12
    Contributor Speakpigeon's Avatar
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    Thanks to the other three voters...

    Still, at least 13 visitors to this thread and only four votes?! Even if we discount the brain dead, I think we can do a little bit better than that.

    If you think you don't know the answer, fair enough, there's an option "Don't know".

    If you think the question doesn't make sense, OK, why not, there's an option "Doesn't make sense".

    So, what's stopping you? What option is missing that could justify your not voting?
    EB

  3. Top | #13
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    A desperate cry for attention and recognition in the dark.

    You chronically promote Aristotelian logic as some kind of mystical-mystical entity which it is not.

    You asked of innate human cognitive ability. It is evidenced by the accomplishments of early humans before any sophisticated language or even speech.

    Animals can work towards a goal.

    How specifically is that not an answer ?

    As a philosopher can you explore viewpoints?

  4. Top | #14
    Contributor Speakpigeon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    A desperate cry for attention and recognition in the dark.
    Can't you just switch the light on if you're afraid of the night?

    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    You chronically promote Aristotelian logic as some kind of mystical-mystical entity which it is not.
    Pork pie.

    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    You asked of innate human cognitive ability. It is evidenced by the accomplishments of early humans before any sophisticated language or even speech.
    Good, if that's what you believe, then vote for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    Animals can work towards a goal.

    How specifically is that not an answer ?
    Possibly, but what took you so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    As a philosopher can you explore viewpoints?
    Start your own thread if you're interested in that topic.
    EB

  5. Top | #15
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    You are a funny guy, really. I brought up animals trwice.

    The abcient Incas and other American cultures were fantastic engineers. Construction, sweage, wtaher supplies, drainage, roads that would be good today. I doubt any of them heard of Arostotle.

    Aristotelians logic is an artificial creating, as is all language.

    We observe followed by trial and error in solving a problem withiout the need to have consdious thought.

    There are chimps that quarry stones, and fashion them into tools to crack nuts. The knowledge is passed on y observation and mimick. No s[peach or written language.

    If invention and survival were based on formal logic there would not be the life we see today.

    A non technical manger asked me to look at a problem. When I gave him the solution he asked me how I derived the solution in a step by step manner. U could not, I did not go through a sequential logical process. I 'saw' the solution without a logical process. The baton assimilates knowledge and experience and distils it to something else. intuition if you like. I expect critters like chimps do the same.

    I would look at a design and come away thinking there was something wrong but nothing specific. It could rake weeks for it to percolate up to conscious thought. Nothing special about me, the same went for many I worked with.

    That is why inexperienced people following a narrow chain of logic can often end up being wrong.

    You appear inexperienced drawing conclusions based on logic and assumption of premises. Yor premises on logic do not bear out in reality.

    Reduce your argument to a syllogism as you like to do. Then we can pick it apart.

  6. Top | #16
    Contributor Speakpigeon's Avatar
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    Stop the booze, John.

    Let's not get delusional: there's no argument.

    Only a simple question:
    Do humans have an inherent capacity to decide that a conclusion follows necessarily from premises?
    Alright, I guess we can close the thing. 100% yeses, not too bad. Thanks again to the voters.

    Only four people voted, though. Everybody else can't bring themselves to do it.

    No excuse since you could also vote "don't know" or "doesn't make sense".

    Not a pretty picture, I'm afraid.
    EB

  7. Top | #17
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    Yes. But I am just guessing.

  8. Top | #18
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    Yes, but one could be annoying and mention that severely disabled or unconscious people can't. So it's actually - conscious, capable humans have an inherent capacity to decide that a conclusion follows necessarily from premises.

  9. Top | #19
    Contributor Speakpigeon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rousseau View Post
    Yes, but one could be annoying and mention that severely disabled or unconscious people can't. So it's actually - conscious, capable humans have an inherent capacity to decide that a conclusion follows necessarily from premises.
    Yes, you're being annoying.

    We can be incapacitated. It's actually not true that humans have two legs and one nose because some people miss those. Do the British people speak English? Well, no, because not when they're in deep sleep or in drunken stupor. We cannot vote in elections since many people literally can't decide who to vote for.

    Please understand "inherent" to signify that it is in our nature. We have two legs because of our nature but some will be missing one or two because of the imponderables of life.

    I guess whatever capacity we have as individual human beings is best explained by the fact that human beings have inherent capacities due to their nature. I wouldn't want to have to explain the fact that we can communicate with each other using sophisticated languages by leaving our DNA out of the picture.

    Maybe I should have asked Do you think you have an inherent capacity to decide that a conclusion follows necessarily from premises?

    But that, too, could be misunderstood.

    Do some humans have an inherent capacity to decide that a conclusion follows necessarily from premises?

    Do some humans have a natural capacity to decide that a conclusion follows necessarily from premises?

    Do you think that the idea of a natural capacity best explain that most humans are able decide that a conclusion follows necessarily from premises?

    My long experience in forum debates tells me that however you frame your question, you'll find people who will object to it, who will ask that you defined you terms, even though the said terms are in the dictionary, and even people who will be actually unable to understand the question. Some people, including on this board, will misunderstand whatever you say.

    It's almost a miracle that we should still think we have any logical capacity.
    EB

  10. Top | #20
    Contributor Speakpigeon's Avatar
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    Here are some of the people who can't decide between "Yes", "No", Don't know" and "Doesn't make sense".

    Koyaanisqatsi,
    prideandfall,
    loose cannon,
    Bearded One,
    abaddon,
    couch_sloth,
    Keith&Co.,
    steve_bank,
    J842P,
    Tharmas,
    Angra Mainyu.
    What's wrong with them, do you think?
    EB

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