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Thread: Cocked and Loaded on Behalf of the Saudis

  1. Top | #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by bilby View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post

    You realize that the "Yemenis" are an Iranian client state? Anything major from there is on orders from Tehran.
    So people keep asserting.

    But the reality of revolutionaries, insurgents, terrorists, freedom fighters, whatever you call them, throughout history, is that they fight first and foremost for themselves, their communities, families, and beliefs. State sponsors and supporters often like to imagine that they are pulling the strings, but the fighters will tolerate being told what to do only so far as it matches their own objectives; And the relationship is invariably more about supplies and logistical support than it is about command and control.
    In detail you are right. In general, though, if you don't do what the guys arming you want you aren't going to get the weapons.

    However, this is a special case anyway--not your typical guns, but high tech weapons. The Houthis pretend they're building them themselves but that's a joke. The drones have Chinese engines and everything else is Iranian. These aren't the toys you can buy off the shelf--such toys don't have the lifting capacity to haul an appreciable warhead.

  2. Top | #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by RVonse View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by T.G.G. Moogly View Post
    Trump has gone from despising SA to being their chums. One really has to wonder if he has any idea what he's doing, particularly in light of his revolving-door cabinet.

    My take is that short of an Iranian invasion or open aggression he's just gonna sit back and take the money. It's really a win-win situation for him personally and politically. He dumped Bolton because he really doesn't want to do anything that threatens his reelection chances or personal cash flow. In every instance where he criticized the previous administration he has done exactly the same thing, the only difference being that publicly he talks a different talk and his minions salivate. He's a pretty good showman in that sense, as he's always been. His entertainment value is what got him elected.

    We'll see if any incontrovertible evidence of Iranian action in these bombings is produced. I don't think we'll see any, even if it's there, and only because he doesn't want to see it, which is the same reason Bolton is gone. And that's not a conspiracy theory, just politics.
    More mindless chatter about Trump.

    You guys can spin and dream away if you want. But in the final analysis, nobody has started another crappy and expensive war right now. Not yet. And thats a gpod thing if you respect all life as I do.

    Pull your head out of your ass for a few seconds of fresh air. And judge people by what they have actually done or not done. In this case, realize no one is yet dying in another stupid war!
    All Trump ever does is talk (such as saying we were on the Saudis’ leash), so that is what we are left with.

  3. Top | #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by RVonse View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by T.G.G. Moogly View Post
    Trump has gone from despising SA to being their chums. One really has to wonder if he has any idea what he's doing, particularly in light of his revolving-door cabinet.

    My take is that short of an Iranian invasion or open aggression he's just gonna sit back and take the money. It's really a win-win situation for him personally and politically. He dumped Bolton because he really doesn't want to do anything that threatens his reelection chances or personal cash flow. In every instance where he criticized the previous administration he has done exactly the same thing, the only difference being that publicly he talks a different talk and his minions salivate. He's a pretty good showman in that sense, as he's always been. His entertainment value is what got him elected.

    We'll see if any incontrovertible evidence of Iranian action in these bombings is produced. I don't think we'll see any, even if it's there, and only because he doesn't want to see it, which is the same reason Bolton is gone. And that's not a conspiracy theory, just politics.
    More mindless chatter about Trump.

    You guys can spin and dream away if you want. But in the final analysis, nobody has started another crappy and expensive war right now. Not yet. And thats a gpod thing if you respect all life as I do.

    Pull your head out of your ass for a few seconds of fresh air. And judge people by what they have actually done or not done. In this case, realize no one is yet dying in another stupid war!
    Iran doesn't do this without Trumpo pulling out of the nuclear deal.

    The problem for the Clown in Chief is that in his wildest dreams he didn't think something like this would happen. He didn't think they'd shoot down drones or commandeer ships either.

    If someone had advised the Orange Clown that Iran is resilient and will keep ratcheting up the ante the Orange Clown would fire him.

    That said, like you, I'm glad he hasn't done anything any more stupid and damaging than he's already done.

  4. Top | #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by T.G.G. Moogly View Post
    If someone had advised the Orange Clown that Iran is resilient and will keep ratcheting up the ante the Orange Clown would fire him.
    The only reason they can ratchet up the ante is because we let them. We should have bombed an IRGC base or two by now.

    That said, like you, I'm glad he hasn't done anything any more stupid and damaging than he's already done.
    Doing nothing is what is stupid in this situation.

  5. Top | #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gun Nut View Post
    sure they can! They just grab them by the husk!
    Depends on whether they are European or African swallows drones.


    Wow. It's rare that I run into an individual that claims to know absolutely everything about something.
    I know, I know. It was a deliberate hyperbole because I was getting fed up dealing with laughing dog and his ignorance. But I assure you, I am not your 7th grade friend.

  6. Top | #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Higgins View Post
    Dime store drones can fly... a short distance. Drones that costs thousands of dollars can be flown larger distances and can take good video/pics. They can't however, drag explosives or missiles along with them.
    Range + speed + decent payload = sophisticated vehicle. Something Iranians could build, but not Houthis. And if Houthis had launched them, why did they fly through Kuwaiti air space and hit the facilities from the north and not the south?

  7. Top | #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by T.G.G. Moogly View Post
    Trump has gone from despising SA to being their chums. One really has to wonder if he has any idea what he's doing, particularly in light of his revolving-door cabinet.
    It's pretty clear he does not.

    or personal cash flow.
    He is too short-sighted! Saudi Arabia already has tall towers (next world's tallest tower is already under construction in Jeddah, and while Americans are involved, Trump is not), but imagine the real estate opportunities if there is regime change in Iran! A Trump Tower in the center of Tehran. Or even better, a 5 star Trump Hotel in the coastal city of Shiraz, with a wine bar on the roof. With an infinity pool, like that triple tower in Singapore. Opportunities are endless!

    We'll see if any incontrovertible evidence of Iranian action in these bombings is produced. I don't think we'll see any, even if it's there, and only because he doesn't want to see it, which is the same reason Bolton is gone. And that's not a conspiracy theory, just politics.
    Well he made a lot of hay about being against the Iraq war, contra Hillary who voted for it. And remember that Hillary wanted to impose a no fly zone in Syria while Trump largely stayed out of it, leaving it to Putin and Rouhani.
    Trump was the peacenik candidate of 2016.

  8. Top | #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiprHead View Post
    Maybe it was this?
    That was probably the immediate cause of the split, but Bolton is a major Iran hawk, so he would have disagreed with the decision not to retaliate over the downed drone, deepening the rift between himself and Trump.

  9. Top | #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by fromderinside View Post
    Wow. A twenty cent spike as 'proof'.
    20 cent spike is proof that this is hardly a matter that only affects Saudi Arabia. It affects the worldwide oil markets.
    And this was a relatively minor attack that Saudis could buffer with their reserves. Next time we may not be so lucky.

    That's less than a couple cups of Starbucks per tank. Surely that's going to cause you to emotionally meltdown.
    Nobody is melting down dude.


    Convenient Chart! It leaves out US output while you claim wrongly we are a net importer which we aren't.
    You are embarrassing yourself with your ignorance dude. US is most definitely a net importer. Yes, US massively increased production due to the shale revolution (note that many Dems want to ban fracking though, jeopardizing that) which reduced our net imports, but we still consume more than we produce.

    Wow Iraq is left off chart with its over four million barrels a day output.
    Yes, Iraq should have been on this chart. But this is a chart of oil EXPORTS, not production. Iraq exports about 3 Mbbl/d, which should have put it on the chart, but it doesn't change my point, which is that KSA is by far the biggest oil exporter.

    Even with corrupt communists in charge Venezuela output is 1.4 million bbl/day and North Sea production is about 2.2 million bbl/day.
    Again, the chart is about EXPORTS. Venezuela exports only about 0.8 Mbbl/d these days.
    And again, my point is that KSA is by far the biggest oil exporter.

    When you want to make a 'point' you match Trump. Sad.
    Nope. You just don't understand the difference between total production and exports.

  10. Top | #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derec View Post
    20 cent spike is proof that this is hardly a matter that only affects Saudi Arabia. It affects the worldwide oil markets.
    And this was a relatively minor attack that Saudis could buffer with their reserves. Next time we may not be so lucky.

    Convenient Chart! It leaves out US output while you claim wrongly we are a net importer which we aren't.
    You are embarrassing yourself with your ignorance dude. US is most definitely a net importer. Yes, US massively increased production due to the shale revolution (note that many Dems want to ban fracking though, jeopardizing that) which reduced our net imports, but we still consume more than we produce.
    EYUP



    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...as_Imports.svg

    Oh wait. You're wrong again.

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