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Thread: Crazy Bible Stories

  1. Top | #101
    Elder Contributor Keith&Co.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Learner View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by atrib View Post

    Oh my fucking god! Not this old nonsense again. Do you know how mountains are formed? Do you know how scientists date rock formations? You keep embarrassing yourself every fucking time you post. I know 10 year old children who know more about the natural world than you do. Really!
    Whale bones.
    Did i miss your citation for your example?

  2. Top | #102
    Contributor DBT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Learner View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Higgins View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Learner View Post

    Its always a faith-trust for me, what else is it as a believer? Take it as a " I know where you stand now" or taking into acoount. Shouldn't stop the discussion being mutually reasonable.
    I believe what you mean to say is that “You don’t know what you are talking about, but you have faith you are right.”
    Not quite. Faith i.e. trusting something is true, doesn't mean " knowing-nothing-at-all!" There is no commandment to say "thall shalt be stupid!!

    (Ok I can be at times but not always, I say with reasonable fairness)
    Trusting that something is true won't make it true. Faith is a conviction of truth held without the support of evidence.

  3. Top | #103
    Contributor skepticalbip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DBT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Learner View Post

    Not quite. Faith i.e. trusting something is true, doesn't mean " knowing-nothing-at-all!" There is no commandment to say "thall shalt be stupid!!

    (Ok I can be at times but not always, I say with reasonable fairness)
    Trusting that something is true won't make it true. Faith is a conviction of truth held without the support of evidence.
    And, far too frequently, faith is conviction of the truth of a belief against overwhelming evidence and reason to the contrary.

  4. Top | #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Learner View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Higgins View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Learner View Post

    Its always a faith-trust for me, what else is it as a believer? Take it as a " I know where you stand now" or taking into acoount. Shouldn't stop the discussion being mutually reasonable.
    I believe what you mean to say is that “You don’t know what you are talking about, but you have faith you are right.”
    Not quite. Faith i.e. trusting something is true, doesn't mean " knowing-nothing-at-all!" There is no commandment to say "thall shalt be stupid!!

    (Ok I can be at times but not always, I say with reasonable fairness)
    That isn’t correct. Faith, in the context you are speaking of, would be better known as arrogant pride. We aren’t talking about unknowns here. We are talking about sciences that are very well established.

    Your “faith” states you believe in something that isn’t generally accepted based on the observations of millions of scientists in a reproducible manner, because the book you follow suggests otherwise and you want that alternative to be true. They are all wrong, and you are right. That is arrogance. Christopher Columbus shared such arrogance, though got lucky with the presence of the New World.

    Quite arrogant. Do you know that the forefathers of almost all of our science tried to use their knowledge and observations to prove the Bible and its god? They couldn’t do it. But you think asking a question or a dozen of already explained poor understandings of science will finally break the dam of reproducible, rock solid scientific observation.

    That isn’t faith, that is arrogance.

  5. Top | #105
    Formerly Joedad
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    Quote Originally Posted by Learner View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by T.G.G. Moogly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Learner View Post
    Well you again didn't read the bible, most of the water came from under not from the sky.
    Where did it all go?
    OR....

    Why is there so much water still left?
    Where did the rest of it go?

  6. Top | #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by T.G.G. Moogly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Learner View Post

    OR....

    Why is there so much water still left?
    Where did the rest of it go?
    Back to where it came from I assume?

  7. Top | #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Higgins View Post
    That isn’t correct. Faith, in the context you are speaking of, would be better known as arrogant pride. We aren’t talking about unknowns here. We are talking about sciences that are very well established.
    We're not talking about the same faith then. What unkowns do you mean? Unseen forces? I was talking about having faith and still being able to be rational within mutual reasonable boundries (for lack of better phrasing). Like the posts where steve-b mentions about rotting corpses after a receding flood - I made a different sugestion within reason - because we know about real living things that die. Different from making any suggestion that God made those dead people/animals flash-vanish before the waters receded. The only aspect of religion used here is in the hypothetical, that the flood took place.

    Your “faith” states you believe in something that isn’t generally accepted based on the observations of millions of scientists in a reproducible manner, because the book you follow suggests otherwise and you want that alternative to be true. They are all wrong, and you are right. That is arrogance. Christopher Columbus shared such arrogance, though got lucky with the presence of the New World.
    Well yes it would be natural as human beings go, I would want the alternative to be conclusively true. That inner-bias, shall we say, is true for either side. Oddly enough many scientists who have made their contributions were religious too. A number of scientists today are still theists.

    Quite arrogant. Do you know that the forefathers of almost all of our science tried to use their knowledge and observations to prove the Bible and its god? They couldn’t do it. But you think asking a question or a dozen of already explained poor understandings of science will finally break the dam of reproducible, rock solid scientific observation.

    That isn’t faith, that is arrogance.
    Well they should be admired with utmost respect although the science would not have flown them acroos the atlantic let alone to the moon as the scientists today - among them are scientists existing, who still hold to their beliefs.

    I accept there could be an arrogance of some degree depending on a variety of particulars with each individual... and what they have claimed as faith who may have the follwong attributes: being in denial, being delusional, or as you say, having arrogant pride.
    Last edited by Learner; 10-19-2019 at 04:11 AM.

  8. Top | #108
    Contributor DBT's Avatar
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    The word faith is often used loosely in reference to a number of concepts, 'good will' - ie - a transaction done in 'good faith,' trust, hope, confidence.....but the essential meaning of 'faith' or to have faith is a belief held without the support of evidence - 'she has faith that her injured son will pull through'' - ''he has faith in God'' etc, etc.

    It is ambiguity of common usage that some theists rely on in order to justify faith....'oh, but we have faith that the chair won't break when we sit on it' and other absurdities.

  9. Top | #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Learner View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by T.G.G. Moogly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Learner View Post

    OR....

    Why is there so much water still left?
    Where did the rest of it go?
    Back to where it came from I assume?
    So the magic water magically appeared and then magically returned to its magical place of origin. And this is the explanation for a religious fairy tale having actually happened for which there is no evidence in the scientific record.

    It's very possible that someone was reading Velikovsky's accounting of biblical events and that you subconsciously absorbed this silliness. His explanations are identical to yours. For him, Venus was the proof. And for you the oceans - or what's left of them - are the proof.

  10. Top | #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by DBT View Post
    The word faith is often used loosely in reference to a number of concepts, 'good will' - ie - a transaction done in 'good faith,' trust, hope, confidence.....but the essential meaning of 'faith' or to have faith is a belief held without the support of evidence - 'she has faith that her injured son will pull through'' - ''he has faith in God'' etc, etc.

    It is ambiguity of common usage that some theists rely on in order to justify faith....'oh, but we have faith that the chair won't break when we sit on it' and other absurdities.
    The bible uses a lot of the variants of the word faith in the proper places. No doubt it may be confusing but not a major deal imo.

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