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Thread: !0 Commandments versus a legal system

  1. Top | #21
    Administrator lpetrich's Avatar
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    Ten-Commandments enthusiasts argue "What can be wrong with objecting to murder and theft?" But murder and theft are (1) very easy to object to and (2) only part of the 10C's.

    It's like saying that it's impossible to object to Buddhism because its Four Noble Truths recognize the suffering in our lives and because its Five Moral Rules forbid murder, theft, lying, sexual misconduct, and consuming anything intoxicating.

  2. Top | #22
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    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_Eightfold_Path

    The Buddhist 8 Fold Path is derived rationally from observance of causes of human suffering. No god needed. Only monks practice celibacy and poverty. Sex is limited to marriage. No intoxicants. Right livelihood, no work that violates morality.. A true moral code.

    Right View: our actions have consequences, death is not the end, and our actions and beliefs have consequences after death. The Buddha followed and taught a successful path out of this world and the other world (heaven and underworld/hell).[28][29][30][31][note 3] Later on, right view came to explicitly include karma and rebirth, and the importance of the Four Noble Truths, when "insight" became central to Buddhist soteriology.[32][33]


    Right Resolve or Intention: the giving up home and adopting the life of a religious mendicant in order to follow the path; this concept aims at peaceful renunciation, into an environment of non-sensuality, non-ill-will (to loving kindness), away from cruelty (to compassion).[34] Such an environment aids contemplation of impermanence, suffering, and non-Self.[34]
    Right Speech: no lying, no rude speech, no telling one person what another says about him.[27]

    Right Conduct or Action: no killing or injuring, no taking what is not given, no sexual acts, no material desires.[27]

    Right Livelihood: beg to feed, only possessing what is essential to sustain life;[27]

    Right Effort: preventing the arising of unwholesome states, and generating wholesome states, the bojjhagā (seven factors of awakening). This includes indriya-samvara, "guarding the sense-doors," restraint of the sense faculties.[35][34]

    Right Mindfulness (sati; Satipatthana; Sampajañña): "retention," being mindful of the dhammas ("teachings," "elements") that are beneficial to the Buddhist path.[36][note 4] In the vipassana movement, sati is interpreted as "bare attention": never be absent minded, being conscious of what one is doing;[38] this encourages the awareness of the impermanence of body, feeling and mind, as well as to experience the five aggregates (skandhas), the five hindrances, the four True Realities and seven factors of awakening.[34]

    Right samadhi (Passaddhi; Ekaggata; sampasadana): practicing four stages of dhyāna ("meditation"), which includes samadhi proper in the second stage, and reinforces the development of the bojjhagā, culminating into upekkha (equanimity) and mindfulness.[39][8] In the Theravada tradition and the Vipassana movement, this is interpreted as ekaggata, concentration or one-pointedness of the mind, and supplemented with Vipassana-meditation, which aims at insight.

  3. Top | #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seyorni View Post
    Why do you single out the West?
    I think legal systems in the West -- and i assume you're talking about Europe and the Americas -- tend to be based on abstract principles of fairness and idealism than those in the ancient world. That's not to say this veneer isn't fragile. If people feel threatened or insecure, the desire for order, convention and predictability can still override principle.
    Fairness and legal systems are not the same.

    sometimes the obliviously guilty go free because of the way the system works. A system of fixed rules and imperfect people can never be perfect. Sometimes the innocent are convicted. It is about a system that maintains order over chaos and individual justice.
    Any system that values ethics (avoiding undue harm to people) and fairness will sometimes let the guilty go free and jail the innocent. Fairness and minimizing of unethical actions are optimized when explicit rules and procedures are followed for determining whether a person is guilty of violating behavioral codes. Violation of those procedures will always create unchecked power that leads to the greatest levels of unfairness and immorality.
    IOW, your setting up a false dichotomy between fixed rules and order versus morality, fairness, and justice. While rules and order can be devoid of morality and fairness, morality and fairness in a large society is not possible without them.

  4. Top | #24
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    The way I see it a moral code is a set of rules. Ethics is how you stick to the rules.

    To the ancient Samurai ritual suicide was the ethical thing to do under certain circumstances.

    What is moral is decided by a culture.

  5. Top | #25
    Mazzie Daius fromderinside's Avatar
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    Humans have William the Conqueror to thank for integrating legal structures in occidental culture. Now, if only we could integrate legal with religious aspects of said culture we might have something that works. Unfortunately one needs find soul to achieve this.

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