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Thread: The Great Contradiction

  1. Top | #631
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AntiChris View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Angra Mainyu View Post
    ...your position about some of the key issues appears to be pretty different now (e.g., about why we should not punish the innocent).
    I'll take your word for it - it was 14 years ago!

    However, as far as I can tell I haven't actually made a case for not punishing the innocent on this thread so I'm not sure how you conclude that my views on this have changed.
    Because your position now is that there is no fact of the matter as to whether someone is guilty, or about what they deserve.

  2. Top | #632
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angra Mainyu View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The AntiChris View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Angra Mainyu View Post
    ...your position about some of the key issues appears to be pretty different now (e.g., about why we should not punish the innocent).
    I'll take your word for it - it was 14 years ago!

    However, as far as I can tell I haven't actually made a case for not punishing the innocent on this thread so I'm not sure how you conclude that my views on this have changed.
    Because your position now is that there is no fact of the matter as to whether someone is guilty
    You're mistaken.

    In fact I have explicitly stated the opposite : "There is a fact of the matter as to whether someone has broken the law." (post #582)

    What I have said, is that there is no fact of the matter as to whether someone has acted immorally. This is a position I held in 2006 and so has not changed.

  3. Top | #633
    Mazzie Daius fromderinside's Avatar
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    I frown upon hair splitting indefinites. Whether one can be guilty of a morally based crime statute and not be be immoral is such an indefinite. From my perspective morals aren't universal. There may be universal trends among man to being moral but each culture has differences which results in morals for each culture being different.

  4. Top | #634
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AntiChris View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Angra Mainyu View Post
    Because your position now is that there is no fact of the matter as to whether someone is guilty
    You're mistaken.

    In fact I have explicitly stated the opposite : "There is a fact of the matter as to whether someone has broken the law." (post #582)

    What I have said, is that there is no fact of the matter as to whether someone has acted immorally. This is a position I held in 2006 and so has not changed.
    When I said "Because your position now is that there is no fact of the matter as to whether someone is guilty", I was not talking about breaking the law. I was talking about morality. By "guilty" I mean in the moral sense, i.e., someone who behaved immorally.

    I did not know you held the position that there are no moral facts in 2006. In fact, after reading several pages of the thread, it was apparent to me that you believed there was a fact of the matter as to who is a wrongdoer, what fairness dictates, what is a correct sense of unfairness, what should motivate us, whether something is an injustice (i.e., a moral injustice) and so on. Now given your replied, I read several more pages, and found a post in which you said there is no objective moral standard. In light of my reading of your previous posts over there, I reckon I just can't understand your position, so I'll leave it at that.

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