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Thread: Intelligence, race and related issues.

  1. Top | #101
    Contributor Trausti's Avatar
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    So if genetic clustering is a "thing," does that mean differences is cognition and behavior could develop over time between separate inbreeding population groups? And might this offer an explanation where social theories consistently fail?

    Local adaptation in European populations affected the genetics of psychiatric disorders and behavioral traits

    The top finding was related to the association between winter minimum temperature and schizophrenia. Additional significant geo-climate results were also observed with respect to bipolar disorder (sunny daylight), depressive symptoms (precipitation rate), major depressive disorder (precipitation rate), and subjective well-being (relative humidity). Beyond geo-climate variables, we also observed findings related to pathogen diversity and language phonological complexity: openness to experience was associated with protozoan diversity; conscientiousness and extraversion were associated with language consonants.

  2. Top | #102
    Contributor Trausti's Avatar
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    Ugh. As the Catholic Church set out to protect the faithful from exposure to dangerous ideas, lets follow Lewontin's example and cover our eyes and ears and watch our tongues.


  3. Top | #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trausti View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by barbos View Post

    That's quite a claim.
    Racists have been trying to prove it for some time but haven't found anything that actually shows it. Everything we see is cultural or medical (nutrition, disease), not genetic.
    But that’s not correct. Mass government spending on education has done nothing to close the achievement gaps. And, curiously, these gaps are largest where the local culture is anti-hereditarian and kneels at the social justice altar, e.g., Berkley, CA, and Madison, WI.
    That could merely show that the barriers are bigger than expected, and/or that the efforts have been badly done. Racist policies to fight racist policies may very well breed more rather than fewer problems. Likewise with the bigotry of low expectations. People often grow into the labels assigned to them. If you aren't expected to amount to much, good chance you won't.

  4. Top | #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toni View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    I have worked with people from around the world. From what I see anyone who has the general equivalent to our primary education are on the average no better or worse rhan anyone else.

    There is a thriving Ethiopian immigrant community in Seattle. Those who come with basic education pick up English. Some go to college or trade schools. Those without the foundation have trouble picking up English and communicating. They are stuck in low wage jobs.

    I'd say culture matters more than any generic variation.

    The problem with statistical studies is isolating all relevant vsaribles.

    In the JFK era the Moinahan Report showed that the biggest factor affecting kids performing in school was income and family stability. Race was not an issue. Controversial at the time. Further it was said welfare was destroying black families exacerbating the problem.
    I’d say that what really matters is opportunity.

    We don’t all get the same opportunity or the same number of opportunities in life. We all have some opportunities. And we all have some burdens. I don’t believe the world will ever be such that opportunity and burden are equally distributed among people, but we could sure do a much better job of easing some of the worst burdens and ensuring that all people get the chances they need to make the most of their lives.
    Start by raising the floor. Don't have anyone worried about if they will eat tomorrow. Have some minimal financial stability for all. Have health care for all as well. Do that and be amazed how the lower ends of society find further upward mobility and with more people productive expect to see everyone benefit.

  5. Top | #105
    Contributor Trausti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jolly_Penguin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Trausti View Post

    But that’s not correct. Mass government spending on education has done nothing to close the achievement gaps. And, curiously, these gaps are largest where the local culture is anti-hereditarian and kneels at the social justice altar, e.g., Berkley, CA, and Madison, WI.
    That could merely show that the barriers are bigger than expected, and/or that the efforts have been badly done. Racist policies to fight racist policies may very well breed more rather than fewer problems. Likewise with the bigotry of low expectations. People often grow into the labels assigned to them. If you aren't expected to amount to much, good chance you won't.
    The thing is that in the US education is a local affair - county/city. There are over 16,000 public school districts in the US. That the achievement gap is apparent in *all* of them shows that you are dealing with something other than policy.

  6. Top | #106
    Elder Contributor barbos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by barbos View Post

    That's quite a claim.
    Racists have been trying to prove it for some time but haven't found anything that actually shows it. Everything we see is cultural or medical (nutrition, disease), not genetic.
    You just repeated your claim.
    I mean I did post a study which directly debunks your "everything" claim

  7. Top | #107
    Super Moderator ruby sparks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barbos View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by barbos View Post

    That's quite a claim.
    Racists have been trying to prove it for some time but haven't found anything that actually shows it. Everything we see is cultural or medical (nutrition, disease), not genetic.
    You just repeated your claim.
    I mean I did post a study which directly debunks your "everything" claim
    Your study must have been badly flawed. Loren thoroughly checks these things you know.
    Last edited by ruby sparks; 12-09-2019 at 11:11 AM.

  8. Top | #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trausti View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jolly_Penguin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Trausti View Post

    But that’s not correct. Mass government spending on education has done nothing to close the achievement gaps. And, curiously, these gaps are largest where the local culture is anti-hereditarian and kneels at the social justice altar, e.g., Berkley, CA, and Madison, WI.
    That could merely show that the barriers are bigger than expected, and/or that the efforts have been badly done. Racist policies to fight racist policies may very well breed more rather than fewer problems. Likewise with the bigotry of low expectations. People often grow into the labels assigned to them. If you aren't expected to amount to much, good chance you won't.
    The thing is that in the US education is a local affair - county/city. There are over 16,000 public school districts in the US. That the achievement gap is apparent in *all* of them shows that you are dealing with something other than policy.
    Is there a racial achievement gap when comparing rich black kids with poor white kids?

  9. Top | #109
    Formerly Joedad
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trausti View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jolly_Penguin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Trausti View Post

    But that’s not correct. Mass government spending on education has done nothing to close the achievement gaps. And, curiously, these gaps are largest where the local culture is anti-hereditarian and kneels at the social justice altar, e.g., Berkley, CA, and Madison, WI.
    That could merely show that the barriers are bigger than expected, and/or that the efforts have been badly done. Racist policies to fight racist policies may very well breed more rather than fewer problems. Likewise with the bigotry of low expectations. People often grow into the labels assigned to them. If you aren't expected to amount to much, good chance you won't.
    The thing is that in the US education is a local affair - county/city. There are over 16,000 public school districts in the US. That the achievement gap is apparent in *all* of them shows that you are dealing with something other than policy.
    No. Our family moved around a lot. School districts were different because of policy decisions. Some of those districts didn't offer the level of opportunity and enrichment that we thought were necessary for proper development. In fact we perceived some of them to be handicapping that process. Culture and money were the differences.

  10. Top | #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trausti View Post
    But that’s not correct. Mass government spending on education has done nothing to close the achievement gaps. And, curiously, these gaps are largest where the local culture is anti-hereditarian and kneels at the social justice altar, e.g., Berkley, CA, and Madison, WI.
    If that was the case Head Start wouldn't be so successful. Children without access to programs like Head Start enter Kindergarten unable to read, and struggle with the alphabet. While the benefits begin to dissipate deeper into grade school, that is most likely an indication that continued enrichment is necessary for certain children that do not have access to enrichment outside of the school. Then you have the other early learning programs that help children to exceed expectations they would never have achieved a generation ago thanks to early diagnoses and adapting to their conditions early on.

    All of this spending helps to alleviate some of the stress for Kindergarten and onward teachers, requiring a smaller spectrum of capabilities of their students to adjust to. Of course, each dime has to be dragged out of the wallets in many red state capitals across the nation.

    Right-wing commentary on public schooling is on the level of fan fiction with virtually no actual experience in the field.

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