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Thread: 5 stabbed at rabbi's Hanukkah celebration by intruder with machete-type knife

  1. Top | #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by laughing dog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post

    The point is you are expecting that level of performance from the average gun owner.
    You need to explain why anyone would think that is a bad idea.
    It's the sort of performance only possible for those who spent vast amounts of time and resources doing it--those for which it's their job and someone else is paying the bills. It's not practical for anyone else.

  2. Top | #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by laughing dog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post

    The point is you are expecting that level of performance from the average gun owner.
    You need to explain why anyone would think that is a bad idea.
    It's the sort of performance only possible for those who spent vast amounts of time and resources doing it--those for which it's their job and someone else is paying the bills. It's not practical for anyone else.
    You are claiming that it is a bad idea for gun owners to be proficient in the use of guns? One would think it is common sense that gun owners be proficient in the use of such dangerous tools.

  3. Top | #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Higgins View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel
    The point is you are expecting that level of performance from the average gun owner.
    I'm expecting that a gun owner should show competence with a weapon before being allowed to have more dangerous weapons. A person shouldn't be allowed to have access to more dangerous weapons simply because they lack competency with a better (less collateral) gun.

    We don't give a 16 year old keys to a semi-trailer if they have never driven before because that'll help ensure he'll get to his destination.
    So you're going to ask for indy drivers to drive any vehicle over 100hp?
    No... I didn't mention Indy Car at all. I mentioned competency and expecting people only be allowed access to more dangerous or difficult to use weapons once proving competency with a lesser dangerous one first.

  4. Top | #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by laughing dog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post

    The point is you are expecting that level of performance from the average gun owner.
    You need to explain why anyone would think that is a bad idea.
    It's the sort of performance only possible for those who spent vast amounts of time and resources doing it--those for which it's their job and someone else is paying the bills. It's not practical for anyone else.
    If you want a weapon that can kill people, asking them to be able to actually shoot people accurately is not something that should be unexpected.

  5. Top | #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Higgins View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post
    It's the sort of performance only possible for those who spent vast amounts of time and resources doing it--those for which it's their job and someone else is paying the bills. It's not practical for anyone else.
    If you want a weapon that can kill people, asking them to be able to actually shoot people accurately is not something that should be unexpected.
    Why are you injecting common sense into an argument about guns?

  6. Top | #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by laughing dog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post

    It's the sort of performance only possible for those who spent vast amounts of time and resources doing it--those for which it's their job and someone else is paying the bills. It's not practical for anyone else.
    You are claiming that it is a bad idea for gun owners to be proficient in the use of guns? One would think it is common sense that gun owners be proficient in the use of such dangerous tools.
    I am objecting to the level of proficiency being asked for--far above what most law enforcement people can do.

  7. Top | #247
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Higgins View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post

    So you're going to ask for indy drivers to drive any vehicle over 100hp?
    No... I didn't mention Indy Car at all. I mentioned competency and expecting people only be allowed access to more dangerous or difficult to use weapons once proving competency with a lesser dangerous one first.
    The standards being asked for for guns are the equivalent of only giving driver's licenses to indy car drivers.

  8. Top | #248
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Higgins View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post

    So you're going to ask for indy drivers to drive any vehicle over 100hp?
    No... I didn't mention Indy Car at all. I mentioned competency and expecting people only be allowed access to more dangerous or difficult to use weapons once proving competency with a lesser dangerous one first.
    The standards being asked for for guns are the equivalent of only giving driver's licenses to indy car drivers.
    Seeing a threshold hasn’t been provided, that statement is as bullshit as the analogy. Which is why you need to use a stupid analogy in the first place as a smokescreen to justify access to weapons people aren’t competent at using.

  9. Top | #249
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by laughing dog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post

    It's the sort of performance only possible for those who spent vast amounts of time and resources doing it--those for which it's their job and someone else is paying the bills. It's not practical for anyone else.
    You are claiming that it is a bad idea for gun owners to be proficient in the use of guns? One would think it is common sense that gun owners be proficient in the use of such dangerous tools.
    I am objecting to the level of proficiency being asked for--far above what most law enforcement people can do.
    There is nothing wrong nor irrational to move to raise the level of proficiency of most law enforcement people. In fact, it appears to be common sense.

  10. Top | #250
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Higgins View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel View Post

    The standards being asked for for guns are the equivalent of only giving driver's licenses to indy car drivers.
    Seeing a threshold hasn’t been provided, that statement is as bullshit as the analogy. Which is why you need to use a stupid analogy in the first place as a smokescreen to justify access to weapons people aren’t competent at using.
    A standard has been provided--he's expecting sky marshal level performance from all gun owners--and looking at sky marshals from before the era of frangible ammunition. Note that US marshals these days carry .357s, not .22s.

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