Page 10 of 27 FirstFirst ... 8910111220 ... LastLast
Results 91 to 100 of 270

Thread: Why did our universe begin? (Split from Atheist wins Nobel Prize thread)

  1. Top | #91
    Contributor skepticalbip's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Searching for reality along the long and winding road
    Posts
    6,113
    Archived
    12,976
    Total Posts
    19,089
    Rep Power
    70
    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    All the 'why' questions are unanswerable by science. Science proper provides predictive models, some of which can be extreme extrapolations.
    But that 'why question' was about excreationist's reasoning, not about the physics. People generally have a reason for imagining some specific scenario. A question about their reasoning is a 'why question'.

  2. Top | #92
    Content Thief Elixir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Mountains
    Posts
    15,742
    Archived
    707
    Total Posts
    16,449
    Rep Power
    58
    Our universe was created as a test bed for the process of evolution.
    The experiment has obviously gone terribly awry.

  3. Top | #93
    Contributor
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    seattle
    Posts
    6,166
    Rep Power
    20
    Quote Originally Posted by skepticalbip View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    All the 'why' questions are unanswerable by science. Science proper provides predictive models, some of which can be extreme extrapolations.
    But that 'why question' was about excreationist's reasoning, not about the physics. People generally have a reason for imagining some specific scenario. Inquiring as to that reasoning is a 'why question'.
    Why ask why?????

    The question goes back to the early recoded thinkers. As of today no answer. It is one of those so called 'perennial questions' like 'why am I hear?', 'why does bad things happen to good people?'

    Religion has always provided answers. I worked with a competent rational engineer who was also Christian. He told me without religion he would be plagued with questions in his head during the day. Religion does serve a purpose.

    excrearionist is always nsearching for some guiding spirit in his threads.

  4. Top | #94
    Contributor
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    seattle
    Posts
    6,166
    Rep Power
    20
    Quote Originally Posted by skepticalbip View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    All the 'why' questions are unanswerable by science. Science proper provides predictive models, some of which can be extreme extrapolations.
    But that 'why question' was about excreationist's reasoning, not about the physics. People generally have a reason for imagining some specific scenario. Inquiring as to that reasoning is a 'why question'.
    Why ask why????? Because humans have a vast imagination which can create questions and fears. I as a human can build a spear, therefore someone must have built the Earth.

    The question goes back to the early recoded thinkers. As of today no answer. It is one of those so called 'perennial questions' like 'why am I hear?', 'why does bad things happen to good people?'

    Religion has always provided answers. I worked with a competent rational engineer who was also Christian. He told me without religion he would be plagued with questions in his head during the day. Religion does serve a purpose.

    excrearionist is always searching for some guiding spirit in his threads.

  5. Top | #95
    Elder Contributor Keith&Co.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Far Western Mass
    Posts
    20,339
    Archived
    24,500
    Total Posts
    44,839
    Rep Power
    88
    Quote Originally Posted by Bomb#20 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by skepticalbip View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by excreationist View Post
    A simulation like our universe within a universe that might have similar physics.
    Why similar physics?
    Because the simulation programmers have to have been copying a natural phenomenon -- physics in our universe is so psychotic no rational beings could have invented it.
    When you say rational.....


    "Okay, okay, okay. "They live on these....balls, see. And the balls spin around."
    "And throw them off! LMFAO!"
    "No, no! (Takes a hit) They stick to the balls." (Passes toke)
    "Sticky balls?" (Takes a hit)
    "Kinda. But it's..." (waves vaguely)
    "It's an intangible stickiness. Because the balls are just so big."
    "Oh, wow....."

  6. Top | #96
    Veteran Member excreationist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    1,021
    Archived
    4,886
    Total Posts
    5,907
    Rep Power
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by skepticalbip View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by excreationist View Post
    A simulation like our universe within a universe that might have similar physics.
    Why similar physics?
    Either they have similar physics or they invented it... (or a combination). I have doubts that they'd invent the physics that allow quantum computers because they might only be able to simulate them with quantum computers of their own - or use some kind of AI...

    A universe where c was not a limit or any of the other physical limits of our universe didn't exist would solve all the problems of your simulated universe.
    A universe without a cosmic speed limit would be much less practical to simulate....

    e.g. (post #149)
    https://talkfreethought.org/showthre...l=1#post855918

    Say our civilization had spread across the galaxy. A simulation which takes 100,000 years to send messages across the galaxy would be easier and cheaper to simulate than one that took a second or less....

    Our universe could be a teaching tool for them to show how many problems must be overcome in a universe with limits.
    Like I said I think the purpose might be for entertainment or personal growth.... the problems in a universe with limits mainly relate to things like space colonization.

    If it is assumed that we are in a simulation then anything can be assumed about the universe that created us.
    I think the outside universe would have more complexity and information than the simulation.... though the simulation could have apparent complexity using simple algorithms like the Mandelbrot Set. ("procedural generation" like how a Minecraft world is based on a single seed)

    ETA:
    Theists imagine just such a universe for their creator. He can be everywhere at once, poof anything he desires with no effort, knows everything, etc. He lives in a universe with no speed of light limitation, where entropy does not apply, no conservation laws for energy or mass, no quantum uncertainty, etc. Why not a similar universe for the creator of the simulation we live in that you imagine?
    Christians usually believe in a limited speed of light (or at least shortly after the universe was created for YECs). One of the only incompatibilities with theism and a simulation is that a literal eternity can't exist.... which isn't such a bad thing if their God created a hell....

  7. Top | #97
    Fair dinkum thinkum bilby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    The Sunshine State: The one with Crocs, not Gators
    Posts
    23,808
    Archived
    10,477
    Total Posts
    34,285
    Rep Power
    93
    Quote Originally Posted by skepticalbip View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    All the 'why' questions are unanswerable by science. Science proper provides predictive models, some of which can be extreme extrapolations.
    But that 'why question' was about excreationist's reasoning, not about the physics. People generally have a reason for imagining some specific scenario. A question about their reasoning is a 'why question'.
    Why?


  8. Top | #98
    Formerly Joedad
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    PA USA
    Posts
    7,343
    Archived
    5,039
    Total Posts
    12,382
    Rep Power
    82
    Proof that the best answer to a why question is, "Because why."

  9. Top | #99
    Veteran Member WAB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Lake Havasu City, AZ
    Posts
    3,506
    Archived
    2,174
    Total Posts
    5,680
    Rep Power
    67
    Quote Originally Posted by Lion IRC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by GenesisNemesis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by bilby View Post
    Jesus fucking christ. The person who thinks logically fallacious reasoning leads to truth is now trying to teach logic to others.

    To paraphrase a well known quote from Jaws (1975) - We're gonna need a bigger facepalm emoji.
    Lion: "I believe Jesus is both his Father and his Son. Also I believe Jesus fed 5,000 people with five loaves of bread and two fish! I am quite the expert in logic, yes."
    WUT?
    Miracles are not a violation of logic.
    Your lack of understanding of a thing doesn't make that thing illogical.
    Lion, you are a sweet person and my friend. Help me untangle a bit of cognitive dissonance?

    In the Garden of Gethsemane, Christ prays to God (Abba, Father), and asks that the cup be passed to another. Jesus is clearly afraid of the unconscionably horrible suffering He will have to endure. Also, on the cross, He says, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?"

    I wrote a villanelle called "Palms" which speculates that perhaps Christ's human side was suffering so much pain that He had literally forgotten for a moment what was going on...

    When I posted the poem for critique at Eratosphere, I received a lot of compliments, but also some heavy critique from people, Trinitarians, who would never entertain such a radical and heretical notion.

    I wish I could point you to the poem, but it is not on my blog. I removed it in a moment of regret, along with a villanelle about the Annunciation.

    Later gator...
    My name is Kit Marlowe. I was NOT killed in a bar in 1593. I came to this century in a time machine of my own design, to report to this advanced society the truth concerning the mysterious author of the plays of William Shakespeare...who...just happens to be me...

  10. Top | #100
    Contributor
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    seattle
    Posts
    6,166
    Rep Power
    20
    How does a simulation programmer know if he is actually a construct of the simulation?

    Joe the programmer says 'I program therefore I am'.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •