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Thread: Should Joe Biden be the last US President in that presidency's current form?

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    Administrator lpetrich's Avatar
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    Should Joe Biden be the last US President in that presidency's current form?

    Why Joe Biden Should Be Our Last President - YouTube

    Political consultant and columnist Alexis Grenell advocates a parliamentary system of government, one where the legislature runs the executive branch.

    She notes that such nations often have multiple parties, so one doesn't see what one has here, neo-Nazis proposing as Republicans. In such places, they have their own parties. It also happens on the Left, with left-wingers and centrists having their own parties. AOC once said that in any other country, she and Joe Biden would be in different parties. An overstatement, maybe, but not much of an overstatement.

    She then described some research into which nations tend to suffer coups. Nations with parliamentary systems were much less likely to suffer coups than those with presidential systems, those with independent presidents like what the US has.

    She likes ranked-choice voting because its winner will be someone who got a majority of the votes, even if that candidate was not the first choice of many voters.

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    Administrator lpetrich's Avatar
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    46 and Done: Why Joe Biden Should Be Our Last President | The Nation - Parliamentary democracies give their citizens tuition-free college, state-subsidized child care, generous paid leave, socialized medicine. We get “Hail to the Chief.”
    The United States is the longest-running presidential democracy in the world, an anomaly in a sea of mostly failed experiments. And it’s the only pure presidential system, according to political scientist Arend Lijphart in his list of the 21 continuous democracies since World War II. The vast majority of advanced democracies have converted to parliamentary systems, which have empirically proved to be less contentious and more productive.
    Then noted Constitutional Frameworks and Democratic Consolidation: Parliamentarianism versus Presidentialism on JSTOR - "This article reports the findings of the analysis of numerous different sources of data, all of which point in the direction of a much stronger correlation between democratic consolidation and the constitutional framework of pure parliamentarianism than between consolidation and pure presidentialism."

    Back to The Nation. About that article,
    Alfred Stepan and Cindy Skach’s exhaustive study of emerging democracies, conducted from 1979 through 1989, found that parliamentary systems were three times more likely to succeed than presidential ones, which were more than twice as susceptible to a military coup, at a rate of 40 percent. Their study, published in 1993, analyzed 93 countries that had become independent since 1945 and found that 61 percent of those that chose a parliamentary system could still be considered democracies just a few decades later. Not a single presidential system in that same time frame has survived as a continuous democracy.

    And for the duration of their short life, it’s usually a shit show. Presidents have a legislative majority less than half the time, compared with 83 percent in parliamentary states, which produce multiple parties and, often, coalition governments that actually support the work of the prime minister. Governing coalitions require compromise, and since a parliament elects the prime minister—as opposed to the people—the legislative and executive branches have a shared agenda.
    Checks and balances seem like a good sort of idea, but in practice, they can produce gridlock. Consider Mitch McConnell's obstructionism.
    But rather than expecting people who’ve been red-pilled to put country over party, we need more parties. That way, at least the Nazi-curious incels who live on the Internet can confine themselves to their own club. It also creates space on the left to develop an actual party independent of the Democrats, who should and can coexist with centrist Republicans.
    Then about parties having to compromise with each other when forming a governing coalition.
    What kind of policies might emerge in the United States from such an unholy alliance? Tuition-free college, state-subsidized child care, generous paid leave, socialized medicine—you know, the hallmarks of the European social safety net that is the envy of every Bernie-loving bro and sis.

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    Administrator lpetrich's Avatar
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    Democracy Index - by The Economist magazine
    List of countries by system of government
    List of electoral systems by country

    Looking at The Economist's Democracy Index, and comparing to systems of government, I find:
    • Parl: Norway, Iceland, Sweden, New Zealand, Canada, Finland, Denmark, Ireland, Netherlands, Australia
    • Semi-pres: Taiwan
    • Parl: Switzerland, Luxembourg, Germany.
    • Pres: Uruguay
    • Parl: UK
    • Pres: Chile
    • Parl: Austria
    • Pres: Costa Rica
    • Parl: Mauritius, Japan, Spain
    • Pres: South Korea
    • Semi-pres: France
    • Pres: US
    • Semi-pres: Portugal
    • Parl: Estonia, Israel, Italy, Malta, Czechia
    • Semi-pres: Cape Verde
    • Parl: Botswana
    • Pres: Cyprus
    • Parl: Slovenia, Belgium, Greece, Latvia, Malaysia
    • Pres: Panama
    • Parl: Trinidad & Tobago
    • Semi-pres: Lithuania
    • Parl: Jamaica
    • Semi-pres: East Timor
    • Parl: South Africa
    • Pres: Colombia
    • Parl: Slovakia
    • Pres: Argentina, Brazil
    • Semi-pres: Poland

    Parl = parliamentary system, Pres = presidential system, Semi-pres: semi-presidential system, a hybrid of the previous two.

    It's evident that the top scorers tend to have parliamentary systems.

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    The phrase, "no fucking way" comes to mind. America's government has issues, as do all democracies. However, we should be aiming at retracting election cycles from their gargantuan lengths of 12 months for House and Senate and 24 months for the Presidency. Our Government spends more time running for Government than running the Government!

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    Reduce the threshold to remove a president by impeachment to 50%, and you get a parliamentary system.

    To make a parliamentary system actually work, you need generations of political culture to change. There are a lot more than just laws that go into what kind of political system a country has.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lpetrich View Post
    Democracy Index - by The Economist magazine
    List of countries by system of government
    List of electoral systems by country

    Looking at The Economist's Democracy Index, and comparing to systems of government, I find:
    • Parl: Norway, Iceland, Sweden, New Zealand, Canada, Finland, Denmark, Ireland, Netherlands, Australia
    • Semi-pres: Taiwan
    • Parl: Switzerland, Luxembourg, Germany.
    • Pres: Uruguay
    • Parl: UK
    • Pres: Chile
    • Parl: Austria
    • Pres: Costa Rica
    • Parl: Mauritius, Japan, Spain
    • Pres: South Korea
    • Semi-pres: France
    • Pres: US
    • Semi-pres: Portugal
    • Parl: Estonia, Israel, Italy, Malta, Czechia
    • Semi-pres: Cape Verde
    • Parl: Botswana
    • Pres: Cyprus
    • Parl: Slovenia, Belgium, Greece, Latvia, Malaysia
    • Pres: Panama
    • Parl: Trinidad & Tobago
    • Semi-pres: Lithuania
    • Parl: Jamaica
    • Semi-pres: East Timor
    • Parl: South Africa
    • Pres: Colombia
    • Parl: Slovakia
    • Pres: Argentina, Brazil
    • Semi-pres: Poland

    Parl = parliamentary system, Pres = presidential system, Semi-pres: semi-presidential system, a hybrid of the previous two.

    It's evident that the top scorers tend to have parliamentary systems.
    Arizona is trying to pass a law saying it doesn't matter who voters select as President - the legislature can appoint whoever they want.
    If that works, there will never be another Democrat President. Gerrymandering will ensure it.

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    The statistics may suggest the Presidential system is bad. But statistics suggest teenagers are bad drivers, yet some teens are excellent drivers. In times past the U.S.A. has done very well with its Presidential system.

    Teddy Roosevelt was a great President, as was his nephew-in-law FDR. A parliamentary system would never have landed Men on the Moon, as the U.S. did with President Kennedy's inspiration. Harry Truman's Marshall Plan is another example of something that simply couldn't have happened in a Parliamentary system.

    It might be correct that those days are gone, and that at this point the U.S. would be better off switching to a different system. If so, it tells us something very sad about this once-great country.

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    I think if we could reform voting in every state, a lot of these other pie in the sky dreams will not be needed.

    I could be wrong, but I think the problem is structural, just at a more basic level.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Worldtraveller View Post
    I think if we could reform voting in every state, a lot of these other pie in the sky dreams will not be needed.

    I could be wrong, but I think the problem is structural, just at a more basic level.
    This.
    When conservatives realize they cannot win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. They will abandon democracy.

    Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor but because we can't satisfy the rich.

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    Political consultant and columnist Alexis Grenell advocates a parliamentary system of government, one where the legislature runs the executive branch.
    I agree with her, in principle. Our current system is an archaic, worse than obsolete. It's a holdover from the olden days, when the federal government was entirely compromised wealthy WASP males, who's only real interest was protecting their wealth and privilege. The president wasn't expected to have any particular influence over the domestic policies of the 13 sovereign colonial states.
    Things have changed hugely since then.

    But the devil is in the details. The current situation has been carefully massaged and shaped to protect the interests of the new wealthy elites. I don't much trust the beneficiaries of the current system to dismantle the institution that works so well for them and replace it with something that works better for the rest of the USA. It's not just asking the fox to guard the chicken coop. It's giving the fox permission to redesign the chicken coop.

    What could go wrong?
    Tom

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