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Thread: Cruise Ships and Ocean Liners

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    Administrator lpetrich's Avatar
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    Cruise Ships and Ocean Liners

    Has anyone here traveled aboard one?

    Early in my childhood, long ago, I traveled aboard the ocean liner SS France across the Atlantic Ocean from NYC to London. I don't remember any of it, but my mother does.

    The SS France was an ocean liner, and strictly speaking not quite a cruise ship. But it was eventually sold and renamed SS Norway, and it served as a cruise ship in the Caribbean and sometimes elsewhere.

    Ocean liner vs. cruise ship.

    An ocean liner is a ship designed for everyday travel across an ocean, and they are often built for speed. Ocean liners often had different classes of passenger accommodation, from the cheap and cramped to expensive and luxurious. Ocean liners went out of service with the rise of transcontinental air travel, and there is now only one ocean liner in service: the Queen Mary 2.

    Cruise ships are for leisure travel, and they are often designed for low draft (depth beneath the water), so they can visit more ports. They have much less class distinction, and they usually go to touristy places like the Caribbean and high-latitude places like Alaska, Scandinavia, and Antarctica.

    There is some crossover. Present-day and recent ocean liners offer experiences much like what cruise ships offer, and cruise ships sometimes travel across oceans in "repositioning" trips. Trips like between the Caribbean in winter and Scandinavia in summer.

    The more luxurious accommodations of past ocean liners also seem rather like what cruise ships offer.

    Ocean Liners vs Cruise Ships | Chris Frame's Cunard Page: Cunard Line History, Facts, News

    Queen Mary 2 Luxury Cruise Ship - Explore with Cunard

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    Naming ships has been done for some centuries now, and it's fun to look for patterns in the names.

    List of White Star Line ships
    The company started with some 42 sailing ships over 1846 - 1869, and their names jumped around like crazy.

    In 1870, the company started building engine-driven ships, and nearly all those ships' names ended in -ic and many of them were place names or ethnic names.

    Adriatic (2), Afric, Albertic, Arabic (3), Armenian, Asiatic, Athenic, Atlantic, Baltic (2), Baltic, Bardic, Belgic (4), Bovic, Britannic (3), Calgaric, Canopic, Cedric, Celtic (2), Ceramic, Cevic, Coptic, Corinthic, Cretic, Cufic (2), Cymric, Delphic (2), Doric (2), Gaelic (2), Gaelic, Gallic (2), Georgic (2), Germanic, Gothic, Haverford, Homeric, Ionic (2), Justicia, Lapland, Laurentic (2), Magnetic, Majestic (2), Medic, Megantic, Mobile, Naronic, Nomadic (2), Oceanic (3), Olympic, Persic, Pittsburgh, Poland, Pontic, Regina, Republic (2), Romanic, Runic (2), Suevic, Tauric, Teutonic, Titanic, Traffic (2), Tropic (2), Vaderland, Vedic, Victorian, Zealandic

    Cunard Line from 1840 to the present, though it is now a subsidiary of Carnival Cruises. Many of the names are place names, often from Greco-Roman antiquity.

    Abyssinia, Acadia, Africa, Alaunia (2), Alaunia (3), Aleppo, Algeria, Alpha, Alps, Alsatia, America, Andania (3), Andes, Antonia, Aquitania, Arabia (2), Ascania (2), Asia, Athenia, Atlantic Causeway, Atlantic Conveyor, Atlantic Conveyor, Atlantic Star, Atlas, Aurania (3), Ausonia (2), Australasian, Bactria, Balbec, Bantria, Batavia, Berengaria, Beta, Bosnia, Bothnia (2), Brescia, Brest, Britannia, British Queen, Calabria, Caledonia, Cambria, Cameronia, Campania, Canada, Caria, Carinthia (3), Carmania (2), Caronia (3), Carpathia, Cassandra, Catalonia, Cephalonia, Cherbourg, China, Columbia, Corscia, Cuba, Cunard Adventurer, Cunard Ambassador, Cunard Calamanda, Cunard Campaigner, Cunard Caravel, Cunard Carrier, Cunard Carronade, Cunard Cavalier, Cunard Chietain, Cunard Countess, Cunard Crown Dynasty, Cunard Crown Jewel, Cunard Crown Monarch, Cunard Princess, Curlew, Cypria, Damascus, Delta, Emeu, Emperor Of India, Empress Of India, Etna, Etruria, Europa, Feltria, Flavia, Folia, Franconia (3), Gallia, Helca, Hibernia, Italian, Ivernia (2), Jackal, Java, Jura, Karnak, Kedar, Laconia (2), Lancastria, Lebeanon, Letitia, Lotharingia, Lucania, Lusitania, Lycia, Malta, Marathon, Margaret, Mauretania (2), Media, Melita, Morocco, Nantes, Niagara, Nordia, Olympus, Orduna, Oregon, Otter, Palestine, Palmyra, Pannonia, Parthia (2), Pavia, Pavonia, Persia, Phrygia, Queen Elizabeth (2), Queen Elizabeth 2, Queen Mary, Queen Mary 2, Queen Victoria, Royal George, Royal Viking Sun, Russia, Sagafjord, Samaria (2), Saragossa, Satellite (2), Sauturnia, Saxonia (2), Scotia, Scythia (2), Sea Goddess I, Sea Goddess II, Servia, Shamrock, Siberia, Sidon, Skirmisher, Slavonia, Stromboli, Sylvania (2), Thracia, Tripoli, Tuscania, Tyria, Ultonia, Umbria, Unicorn, Valacia, Vandalia, Vandyck, Vasari, Vasconia, Vauban, Vaurdulia, Vellavia, Vennonia, Venusia, Verbania, Verentia, Veria, Vestris, Vindelia, Vinovia, Virgilia, Vistafjord, Vitellia, Volodia

    Cunard's current fleet is its second plain Queen Elizabeth, Queen Mary 2, and Queen Victoria. It has ordered another ship, but the only other notable British female monarch that I can think of is Queen Boudica.

    This line has gone through Queen Liz, Queen Liz 2, and now on its second plain Queen Liz.

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    Or might the Cunard Line name its next ship Margaret Thatcher?

    The first Cunard Queen Mary is now a a hotel and exhibit in Long Beach, CA.

    Cunard is only one of the brands of Carnival Corporation & plc - it has several others.

    AIDA Cruises
    AIDAaura, AIDAbella, AIDAblu, AIDAblu, AIDAcara, AIDAcosma*, AIDAdiva, AIDAluna, AIDAmar, AIDAmira, AIDAnova, AIDAperla, AIDAprima, AIDAsol, AIDAstella, AIDAvita
    (* is future)

    Carnival Cruise Line
    (Empress) Mardi Gras, Carnivale, (Festivale) Festivale, (Tropicale) Tropicale, (Holiday) Jubilee, Celebration, Holiday, (Fantasy) Cardinal Fantasy, Cardinal Fascination, Carnival Imagination, Carnival Inspiration, Carnival Ecstasy, Carnival Sensation, Carnival Elation, Carnival Paradise, (Spirit) Carnival Spirit, Carnival Pride, Carnival Legend, Carnival Miracle, (Conquest) Carnival Conquest, Carnival Glory, Carnival Valor, Carnival Liberty, Carnival Freedom, (Concordia) Carnival Splendor, (Dream) Carnival Dream, Carnival Magic, Carnival Breeze, (Destiny) Carnival Sunshine, Carnival Sunrise, Carnival Radiance, (Vista) Carnival Vista, Carnival Horizon, Carnival Panorama, (Excel) Mardi Gras, Carnival Celebration*

    In () is the name of the class of ships. I can detect some patterns.

    Costa Cruises - I've omitted the pre-Costa names.
    Costa Riviera, Costa Marina, Costa Allegra, Costa Classica, Costa Romantica, Costa Playa, Costa Olympia, Costa Victoria, Costa Atlantica, Costa Tropicale, Costa Europa, Costa Concordia, Costa Splendor, Costa Voyager, Costa neoRiviera, Costa Celebration, Costa Mediterranea, Costa Fortuna, Costa Magica, Costa Serena, Costa Pacifica, Costa Favolosa, Costa Fascinosa, Costa Luminosa, Costa Deliziosa, Costa Diadema, Costa Venezia, Costa Firenze, Costa Smeralda, Costa Toscana*

    Holland America Line - I can recognize the names of some Dutch cities.
    Amsterdam, Eurodam, Groote Beer, Koningsdam, Maasdam (3), Nieuw Amsterdam (3), Nieuw Statendam, Noordam (3), Oosterdam, Potsdam, Prinsendam (2), Rotterdam (5,*), Ryndam (2), Sommelsdyk, Statendam (5), Veendam (3), Volendam (3), Waterman, Westerdam (3), Zaandam (2), Zuiderdam, Zuiderkruis

    P&O Cruises
    Adonia (2), Arcadia (3), Artemis, Arvia*, Aurora, Azura, Britannia, Canberra, Iona, Oceana, Oriana (2), Sea Princess / Victoria, Uganda, Ventura,

    P&O Cruises Australia -- all Pacific
    Pacific Adventure, Pacific Aria, Pacific Dawn, Pacific Eden, Pacific Encounter, Pacific Explorer, Pacific Jewel, Pacific Panorama, Pacific Pearl, Pacific Sky, Pacific Splendor, Pacific Star, Pacific Sun

    Princess Cruises
    (various) Princess Patricia, Princess Italia, Princess Carla, Sun Princess, Sea Princess, Royal Princess, Fair Princess, Dawn Princess, Sky Princess, Star Princess, Golden Princess, (Pacific) Pacific Princess, Island Princess, Crown class, Crown Princess, Regal Princess, (Sun) Ocean Princess, Dawn Princess, Sun Princess, Sea Princess, (R) Royal Princess, Ocean Princess, Pacific Princess, (Grand) Golden Princess, Star Princess, Grand Princess, Diamond Princess, Sapphire Princess, Caribbean Princess, Crown Princess, Emerald Princess, Ruby Princess, (Royal) Royal Princess, Regal Princess, Majestic Princess, Sky Princess, Enchanted Princess, Discovery Princess*, (Coral) Coral Princess, Island Princess

    Seabourn Cruise Line - lots of Seabourns
    Seabourn Odyssey, Seabourn Sojourn, Seabourn Quest, Seabourn Encore, Seabourn Ovation, Seabourn Venture*, Seabourn Goddess I, Helsinki Shipyard, Seabourn Goddess II, Helsinki Shipyard, Seabourn Sun, Perno Shipyard, Seabourn Pride, Seabourn Spirit, Seabourn Legend

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    A'Rosa Cruises
    (river cruises)
    A-Rosa Aqua, A-Rosa Brava, A-Rosa Flora, A-Rosa Luna, A-Rosa Mia, A-Rosa Riva, A-Rosa Silva, A-Rosa Stella, A-Rosa Viva, A'Rosa Bella, A'Rosa Blu, A'Rosa Donna

    Ibero Cruises
    Grand Celebration, Grand Holiday, Grand Latino, Grand Mistral, Grand Voyager

    Ocean Village (company) - with these very imaginative names:
    Ocean Village, Ocean Village Two

    Swan Hellenic
    Ankara, Miaoulis, Minerva, Minerva II, Minerva*, Orpheus, Vega

    Windstar Cruises
    Star Breeze, Star Legend, Star Pride, Wind Song, Wind Spirit, Wind Star, Wind Surf

    Royal Viking Line
    Royal Viking Queen, Royal Viking Sea, Royal Viking Sky, Royal Viking Star, Royal Viking Sun

    Viking Cruises
    (river cruises) - I recognize some Norse mythology in some of he names
    Century Sky, Century Star, Century Sun, MS Amadeus Elegant, MS Esplanade, MS Mayfair, MS Omar El Khayam, MS Symphony, MS Vienna, Prince Abbas, Road to Mandalay, Royal Lily, Royal Lotus, RV Tonle Pandaw, Viking Aegir, Viking Alruna, Viking Alsvin, Viking Astrild, Viking Atla, Viking Baldur, Viking Bestla, Viking Beyla, Viking Bragi, Viking Britannia, Viking Burgundy, Viking Buri, Viking Danube, Viking Delling, Viking Deustchland, Viking Douro, Viking Egil, Viking Einar, Viking Eir, Viking Eistla, Viking Embla, Viking Eurodiamond, Viking Europe, Viking Fjorgyn, Viking Fontane, Viking Forseti, Viking Freya, Viking Gefjon, Viking Gersemi, Viking Gullveig, Viking Heimdal, Viking Helgrim, Viking Helvetia, Viking Hemming, Viking Herja, Viking Hermod, Viking Hervor, Viking Hild, Viking Hlin, Viking Idi, Viking Idun, Viking Ingvi, Viking Jarl, Viking Kadlin, Viking Kara, Viking Kari, Viking Kvasir, Viking Lavrinenkov, Viking Legend, Viking Lif, Viking Lofn, Viking Magni, Viking Mandalay, Viking Mani, Viking Mimir, Viking Mississippi*, Viking Modi, Viking Neptune, Viking Njord, Viking Normandie, Viking Odin, Viking Orient, Viking Osfrid, Viking Osiris, Viking Prestige, Viking Pride, Viking Primadonna, Viking Ra, Viking Radgrid, Viking Rinda, Viking Rolf, Viking Saigon*, Viking Schumann, Viking Seine, Viking Sigrun, Viking Sigyn, Viking Skadi, Viking Skaga, Viking Skirnir, Viking Spirit, Viking Star, Viking Sun, Viking Tialfi, Viking Tir, Viking Tor, Viking Torgil, Viking Ullur, Viking Vali, Viking Var, Viking Ve, Viking Vidar, Viking Vilhjalm, Viking Vili

    (ocean cruises) - they seem to be on a planetary kick
    Viking Star, Viking Sea, Viking Sky, Viking Orion, Viking Jupiter, Viking Venus, Viking Mars*, Viking Neptune*

    Norwegian Cruise Line
    Sunward, Starward, Skyward, Southward, Sunward II, Norway, Seaward / Norwegian Sea, Westward, Sunward, Dreamward / Norwegian Dream, Windward / Norwegian Wind, Leeward, Norwegian Crown, Norwegian Star, Norwegian Dynasty, Norwegian Majesty, Norwegian Spirit, Norwegian Sky, Norwegian Sun, Norwegian Star, Norwegian Dawn, Pride of America, Norwegian Jewel, Norwegian Jade, Norwegian Pearl, Norwegian Gem, Norwegian Epic, Norwegian Breakaway, Norwegian Getaway, Norwegian Escape, Norwegian Joy, Norwegian Bliss, Norwegian Encore, Norwegian Prima*

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    Pullmantur Cruises - not much of a naming theme
    Atlantic Star, Blue Dream, Blue Moon, Blue Star, Empress, Grandeur, Holiday Dream, Horizon, Majesty, Monarch, Ocean Dream, Oceanic, Oceanic II, Pacific, R Five, SeaWind Crown, Sky Wonder, Sovereign, Zenith

    Marella Cruises
    Calypso (2), Emerald, Island Breeze, Island Escape, Ithaca, Marella Celebration, Marella Discovery, Marella Discovery 2, Marella Dream, Marella Explorer, Marella Explorer 2, Marella Spirit, Sapphire, Thomson Destiny, Thomson Majesty, Topaz

    Now my final one, the one with the current size champions of cruise ships.
    Royal Caribbean International

    The article divides the ships up by class, and I'll list them that way.
    • Song of Norway: Song of Norway, Nordic Prince, Sun Viking
    • Song of America: Song of America
    • (): Viking Serenade
    • (): Empress of the Seas
    • Sovereign: Sovereign of the Seas, Monarch of the Seas, Majesty of the Seas
    • Vision: Splendour of the Seas, Legend of the Seas, Grandeur of the Seas, Rhapsody of the Seas, Enchantment of the Seas, Vision of the Seas
    • Voyager: Voyager of the Seas, Explorer of the Seas, Adventure of the Seas, Navigator of the Seas, Mariner of the Seas
    • Radiance: Radiance of the Seas, Brilliance of the Seas, Serenade of the Seas, Jewel of the Seas
    • Freedom: Freedom of the Seas, Liberty of the Seas, Independence of the Seas
    • Oasis: Oasis of the Seas, Allure of the Seas, Harmony of the Seas, Symphony of the Seas, Wonder of the Seas*
    • Quantum: Quantum of the Seas, Anthem of the Seas, Ovation of the Seas, Spectrum of the Seas, Odyssey of the Seas,
    • Icon (upcoming)

    I must say that I like "Quantum of the Seas" and "Spectrum of the Seas".

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    "Quantum of the Seas" and "Spectrum of the Seas" - what might be good science-themed ones?

    I thought of former supercontinents: Laurasia, Gondwana, Pangaea, Pannotia, Rodinia, Nuna / Columbia, Kenorland, Vaalbara

    More? There are 118 named chemical elements and numerous named elementary particles.


    All that aside, the SS France (1960) was the largest watercraft that I have ever traveled in by a large margin, though if I ever travel in a cruise ship, it may be even bigger than that one.

    I've gone in a friend's motorboat, and I have traveled on several ferryboats.

    In Croatia when it was a part of Yugoslavia back in 1970(?): one called Postira between Split on the mainland and Bol on the island of Brach (Brac with a v over the c). I remember Postira's engine room being very loud, and I'm sure that it had a diesel engine. I remember once riding a bus across Brach and then taking a hydrofoil(?) ferry to Split.

    In San Francisco Bay, ferries from San Francisco across the bay to Sausalito, Larkspur, and Vallejo.

    My father recalled that his father had an awful job: going inside ships' boilers and cleaning out their mineral deposits. That's because steam would leak from the ships' propulsion systems, leaving behind the mineral content of the water that was used to replenish those systems' water.

    That's nowadays out of date, because other than nuclear-powered ships, just about every ship uses internal combustion engines. It's like with land vehicles. Steam locomotives are long gone, and their successors are all diesel or electric ones.

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    More on the SS France. It belonged to the Compagnie Générale Transatlantique (CGT, or French Line), and it was concieved as a replacement for some aging liners like SS Ile de France and SS Liberté. Also to compete with the Cunard Line, with its plans to construct a big modern liner. Also United States Lines, with its 1952 liner United States.
    At first, the idea of two 35,000-ton running mates was considered to replace Ile de France and Liberté. Charles de Gaulle (the future President of France) opined that it would be better for French national pride, then flagging due to the then ongoing Algerian War of Independence, to construct one grand ocean liner, in the tradition of SS Normandie, as an ocean-going showcase for France. The idea of such a publicly funded liner was controversial, leading to raucous debates in the French parliament.
    There was also the problem of the rise of long-distance air travel, including transoceanic air travel. It threatened to make ocean liners obsolete.

    Though designed as an ocean liner, the SS France could also do cruise-ship duty, by switching between two-class and one-class passenger accommodations. The ship was powered by steam turbines, though it burned oil instead of coal.

    So on 1956, they decided to go ahead with the liner, and in 1962 Feb 3, the ship went into service. For thirteen years, it did a regular run between Le Havre, France and New York City. But air travel was getting more and more popular and fuel was also getting more expensive. So starting in 1972, CGT sent the ship on winter tours. It was too small to fit in the Suez and Panama Canals, so it went around the Cape of Good Hope and Cape Horn.

    Nevertheless, the ship was operating on subsidies from the French government, and the French politicians decided in 1974 to end those subsidies. The ship went out of service late that year, though not without some rebellion by the ship's crew.

    The ship stayed docked in Le Havre for over four years, and after a lot of discussion of its potential fate, it was bought by Norwegian Cruise Line in 1979 and refitted to become a cruise ship. It was reduced from having 4 propellers to 2, and it was given some bow and stern thrusters to avoid needing tugboats while in port. Its interiors were also rebuilt in cruise-ship fashion, to have larger passenger cabins and larger public spaces. It was renamed the Norway, and it was relaunched in 1980.

    The Norway was successful at first, but in the 1990's, it started having some strong competition, even within NCL itself. NCL scrimped on maintenance and the ship had mechanical problems. This included a boiler explosion in 2003.

    The ship was taken out of service in 2004, but the possible demolition of it caused some years of controversy, because of its asbestos insulation. Along the way, in 2006, it was renamed the Blue Lady. Later that year, the ship was beached in a shipbreaking yard in Alang, India. By the end of that year, the bow of the ship was cut off, signaling the start of its demolition, and over the next two years, it was cut to pieces and the pieces removed. By the end of 2008, the ship was gone.

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    Comparison table:
    What Titanic QM France OotS
    Length 269.1 m 310.7 m 315.66 m 360 m
    Beam 28.2 m 36.0 m 33.70 m 60.5 m
    Height 53.3 m 55.2 m 67.66 m 81 m
    Air Draft 42.8 m 43.4 m 57.17 m 72 m
    Draft 10.5 m 11.8 m 10.49 m 9.322 m
    Decks 9 12 12 18
    Passengers 2,435 2,139 2,254 6,699
    Crew 892 1,101 1,253 2,181
    Total 3,327 3,240 3,507 8,880
    Speed 21 kn 28.5 kn 30 kn 24.5 kn
    Service 1912-12 1936-67 1962-2003 2009-
    The ships and their fates:
    • RMS Titanic - sunk by an iceberg
    • SS Queen Mary - museum and hotel in Long Beach CA
    • SS France - scrapped
    • Oasis of the Seas - in service

    Beam is width. Height is total vertical dimension. Draft is depth below waterline when fully loaded. Air draft is height above waterline when fully loaded.

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    Virgin Voyages
    Scarlet Lady, Valiant Lady, Resilient Lady

    Disney Cruise Line
    (Magic) Disney Magic, Disney Wonder, (Dream) Disney Dream, Disney Fantasy, (Triton) Disney Wish

    Celebrity Cruises
    Meridian, (Horizon) Horizon, Zenith, (Century) Celebrity Galaxy, Celebrity Mercury, Celebrity Century, () Celebrity Xperience, (Millennium) Celebrity Millennium, Celebrity Infinity, Celebrity Summit, Celebrity Constellation, (Solstice) Celebrity Solstice, Celebrity Equinox, Celebrity Eclipse, Celebrity Silhouette, Celebrity Reflection, (Edge) Celebrity Edge, Celebrity Apex, Celebrity Beyond, (Expedition) Celebrity Xpedition, Celebrity Xploration, Celebrity Flora

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    Silversea Cruises
    Silver Shadow, Silver Whisper, Silver Spirit, Silver Muse, Silver Moon, Silver Cloud, Silver Wind, Silver Explorer, Silver Origin, Silver Dawn, Silver Nova

    The Silver Spirit was lengthened in 2018 by cutting the ship in two, inserting a prefabricated segment, and then welding these three pieces together.

    Many recent cruise ships were built in prefabricated fashion, by building big pieces of them and then assembling those pieces.

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