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Thread: Today I saved the life of a helpless robin.

  1. Top | #21
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    And today I had a ham sandwich. Tomorrow chicken or steak.

  2. Top | #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    And today I had a ham sandwich. Tomorrow chicken or steak.
    Yes.

    Your empathy does not extend past your needs and desires like so many.

  3. Top | #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by untermensche View Post
    It is not about good or bad.

    It is about the strangeness of caring about the bird but not the living things the bird is eating.

    You have some birds that eat small mammals.

    Do we feel empathy for the bird or the mammal?
    We can feel empathy for both, while realizing that predators are necessary in order to keep the environment healthy. So, I can have empathy for the deer who is eaten by the wolf, while understanding that without the wolf, the deer population would become overly populated, leading to an absence of plants that the deer eat to survive, which would eventually lead to starvation in the deer population etc. It's all about a balance. We need both the predator and the prey to keep the balance of nature intact. ( I stole that from a "Nature" program that I watched yesterday ) How else would we omnivores be able to eat meat? We are strange creatures.

    Having said that, I not claiming that we need human predators to keep humanity in balance, but that's a totally different discussion.

  4. Top | #24
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    Unbounded pure empathy does not recognize the rights of predators to kill.

    It is horrified by the spectacle.

    Empathy has empathy for the life taken by the predator.

    But "empathy" in humans does not usually even extend to the next tribe of humans.

    So having empathy for a bird shows a more sensitive mind than the norm.

    But we must never be surprised by how little empathy humans can have.

    Humans are free to suppress emotions if they choose and can get very good at it with practice.

  5. Top | #25
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    Well, there is a lot that I don't agree with in your most recent post, but I don't have the will to discuss it with you, so I'll leave it at that. I see no point in arguing back and forth relentlessly when it's obvious that we have different viewpoints on things like empathy and how much we are able to control our emotions.

  6. Top | #26
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    A prey animal gets eaten and we feel "ah, poor animal". And we should - it's a conscious and emotional being. But also it's a part of a bigger organism than its individual self (like we all are). The biosystem lives by the death of living beings and its life matters to them all. By all means, expand the ability to sympathize with the rest of life.

    30% of the birds in North America are GONE. Caring more might lead some people to help slow down the loss of life on earth. The individual animals matter but their individual lives are a part of a bigger Life which matters.

    Helping a small bird was a highly moral act. But creating a bird-friendly back yard is more-so. Many more home-owners should do it.

  7. Top | #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by southernhybrid View Post
    Well, there is a lot that I don't agree with in your most recent post, but I don't have the will to discuss it with you, so I'll leave it at that. I see no point in arguing back and forth relentlessly when it's obvious that we have different viewpoints on things like empathy and how much we are able to control our emotions.
    That's passive aggressive but fine.

    There is a reason for somebody trying to save a bird to have empathy. It might help.

    There is no reason for me to create emotions about some bird I never saw that is already dead.

    When thinking about the dead I always remember.

    That is you some day.

  8. Top | #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by untermensche View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by steve_bank View Post
    And today I had a ham sandwich. Tomorrow chicken or steak.
    Yes.

    Your empathy does not extend past your needs and desires like so many.
    I read an anthology of Twain's essays. One he called The Big Loe.

    He was in a city in an open carriage with an upsacle fried, His friend sees a stray cat, stops the carriage, walked past needy people to get the cat, and continued on.

    Selective feel good morality.

    We have trouble providing nutrition d medical service to all ur kids, yet peole donate money to fix broken wings of birds. We spend billions on pet care.

    In some areas birds are pests, like swarming starlings. Sea gulls are flying rats.

    I am not religious but I read Mother Teresa's book, remarkable person. She would literally pick up wretched stinking peple on the street and take then to her hospital.



    Yes we need to protect the ecosystem if anything out of enlightened self interest. As the eco system defares including bio diversity we will suffer. Restoring the bald eagle was a worthy cause. When I livd n North Idaho I used to eatch them fish on Lake Coer D'Alene.

    I regularly took my jeep into the back country and saw a lot of wild life. One winter early in the morning I heard screeching and a tussle outside my house. I went outside and saw blood on the snow, housecat footprints, and bob cat footprints. Breakfast for the bob cat. Mountain lions were known to go after kids in yards, and so on. The natural order of things as they are. I never went off by myself without being armed.

    As it was put in nature there is a natural balance and also natural selection.

    The problem with us humans is our science and technology at least for now isolates is from that reality, but it is catching up with us.

    In the end 'nature' will eventually limit us humans probably with a reduction in population as water and food diminish with climate change.

    Some cultures raise monkeys and dogs as pets, then eats then.

    So in summary, fixing a bird in the grand scheme of things...meh.

  9. Top | #29
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    An old sermon:

    There has been a tremendous storm during the night and the beach is covered in starfish. They are far away from the water and the sun is drying them. All are near death. A small boy is carrying them back to the water, one at a time. A man watches him for a few minutes and says, "Son, what you're doing is noble, but you can't save all these starfish. It won't make a difference." The boy tosses one more starfish in the ocean and says, "It'll make a difference to that one."

  10. Top | #30
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    A dead bird is food for other creatures and decomposes back to nutrients retuned to the environment.

    Is it moral to damper with Mother Nature as if we are god?

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