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Thread: Europe submits voluntarily

  1. Top | #21
    Elder Contributor barbos's Avatar
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    I think 1.6 versus 8.1 is a fertility rate not birth rate. But I doubt muslims in any country have 8.1 fertility rate. Maybe some have 4 but 8 is just impossible.
    OK
    google says Niger is 7.46
    and Palestina 3.95

  2. Top | #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ford View Post
    Oh crap. My boss is on vacation in Europe right now. Should I try to warn him about the impending apocalypse? Or is it already too late?
    This is a long term problem for Europe, but thanks for the strawman.

  3. Top | #23
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    And anyway, there's an elegantly simple solution: honorary French citizenship for the Donald. You just won't believe how great he'll be at solving the problem.

  4. Top | #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by whichphilosophy View Post
    Its a matter of Maths.
    Take a European population with 15% Muslims . Then compare a 1.6 to an 8.1 birth rate. Islam is also fast growing amongst Europeans. I prefer Halal beef by the way.
    You prefer your beef with extra cruelty? Also, you can't get bacon from beef. Finally, Islam doesn't allow alcohol so all those European beers, wines and spirits might be a thing of the past by the end of the century, unless Europeans do something about it.

    If however islam in Europe adopts and retains the culture of its host countries I think many of our civil rights will remain intact.
    Experience with Muslims already in Europe shows that to be quite unrealistic.
    There is a thread on here describing Kim Davis, the county clerk from Kentucky, as 'theocratic ruler'. Yet, prospect of islamic theocracy, which would make Kim Davis look like Richard Dawkins, is not seen as a threat by the Left. What is it with the faux-liberal blind spot when it comes to Islam?

    So pretty soon the host citizens will be a minority.
    And why should Europe not fight against that?

  5. Top | #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by whichphilosophy View Post
    Ive worked for quite a few years in Muslim countries. Its not a problem. I get on with Arabs.
    Sharia law is a problem. Islamic terrorism is a problem.
    I have Palestinian friends.
    Do you also support Palestinian terrorism?

    The problem for Europe is the maths. We have a low birth rate compared to Muslims, especially those in Europe. Europe is very likely to become Muslim but if like Christianity it reforms and allows a secular system there would not be too much to worry about.
    There is obviously much to worry about. Islam is getting more theocratic, not less so. Just look at IS. And speaking of them, how many IS terrorists are streaming into Europe hiding among refugees and other "migrants"?

    If you want to see really racist immigration policies get a look at those in the UAE
    Why aren't UAW and other Muslim counties taking in their Muslim brethren?

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    Quote Originally Posted by untermensche View Post
    Irrational fear of the other.
    No, a quite rational fear of a foreign culture that has shown itself incompatible with secular values and liberal democracy.

    European values should not be a suicide pact! Europe needs to learn that quickly or perish.

  7. Top | #27
    Veteran Member dystopian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derec View Post
    Not all of these "migrants" are actual refugees.
    Irrelevant.


    And there should be a way to help people fleeing wars without giving away Europe's future.
    Giving asylum to refugees is not giving away our future. Stop being a dramaqueen.


    Why can't the Muslim world do more to take in these people?
    It *does*. Europe is not actually where most of the refugees are ending up; that's just the story certain media want you to believe.

    Europe has taken in only around a 150,000 Syrian refugees in total. Compare that to Lebanon, a tiny country of just over 10,000km2 that has taken in more than 1,2 million refugees.

    Why can't more of them stay in Turkey, where they are coming through anyway?
    The majority of them *are* in fact staying in Turkey. Turkey has taken in 2 million refugees; the numbers going on through to Europe represent only a minority of that 2 million.

    Why can't Saudi Arabia, which is both rich, Muslim and has a lot of empty space, take a few hundred thousand of their fellow Muslims?
    A valid question but one that is irrelevant to our own moral duty to help.



    Actually, Muslims are no longer a tiny minority in Europe.
    No, actually, they ARE still a tiny minority. I already stated the figures they represent in this thread. Muslims make up only 3.2% of the European Union's population. That IS a tiny minority.


    and their numbers are increasing.
    It's actually rather questionable that they are. For instance, in the Netherlands the number of muslims has actually gone DOWN every year since 2004. Muslims reached a height of 944.000 people in 2004, whereas today there are 825.000 of them.

    You're relying on the divergence between their birth rates and ours, but as already shown the divergence isn't that great (and the gap is narrowing in any case); and you're not considering secularisation.


    And even when they are a minority there are problems with violence/terrorism,
    Woohoo, profiling!


    with demands for Sharia law etc. This will only get worse by letting hundreds of thousands of more Muslims in.
    Woohoo, bigotry!

  8. Top | #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derec View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ford View Post
    Oh crap. My boss is on vacation in Europe right now. Should I try to warn him about the impending apocalypse? Or is it already too late?
    This is a long term problem for Europe, but thanks for the strawman.
    LOL - "The Islamization of Europe" is the straw man.

  9. Top | #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by barbos View Post
    I think 1.6 versus 8.1 is a fertility rate not birth rate. But I doubt muslims in any country have 8.1 fertility rate. Maybe some have 4 but 8 is just impossible.
    The figures are my error.
    The problem is the quantities of people coming in and financial resources. Criminals are selling Europe to impoverished peoples and putting them in unsafe boats. The media plays this up as our the Europeans fault. The more that make it here, means more will come.

    . We don't have the finances, to cope. I am currently in Italy It has an unemployment rate of around 12 per cent per some sources. Here is one
    http://www.tradingeconomics.com/italy/unemployment-rate Many of the migrants are gathering again around Milan Central station. Maybe just a few hundred. A lot sit on the road side or the grass and some have a few beers to pass the time.
    Wages in Italy are generally quite low and taxation is high. A lot of Italians live at home.
    Even though immigrants are getting just €34.60 a day plus lunch packs to live on which isn't much the Italians cannot really afford this. If people wish to donate voluntarily that's not a problem.

  10. Top | #30
    Veteran Member dystopian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whichphilosophy View Post
    Wages in Italy are generally quite low and taxation is high. A lot of Italians live at home.
    Even though immigrants are getting just €34.60 a day plus lunch packs to live on which isn't much the Italians cannot really afford this. If people wish to donate voluntarily that's not a problem.


    So, you claim they can't afford it... but suddenly if they do voluntary donation it wouldn't be a problem? If voluntary donation is not a problem, then obviously they *can* afford it; you just don't think they should.

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